HomeMy WebLinkAbout710518.tiff Mr. Anderson: We are here to meet, we don't know what is on your mind but
at this time, whatever is on your mind we will hear you out.
Mr. Peddycord: Thank you Mr. Anderson.
Mr. Anderson: We are on tape, I don't want anyone else talking other than
the person who has the floor becuase we don't want to interfere with the
tape in case we want to make a transcript - if you will please state your
naame so we know who is talking.
Mr. Peddycord: I am Clyde Peddycord, spokesman for the Citizens Collition
Committee and we felt that perhaps today would be a time for us to come
and talk with you gentlemen, the Board of County Commissioners , regarding
a call for action which we think is very important.
"Ben Franklin believed that time is money and we do too,
because the longer you postpone responsible business like action,
on the proposal to the Citizens Collition Committee of Weld County
the more you cost the taxpayers who have bleed to long. On April 16
this non-partisian collition after 6 months of research called for the
resignation of Commissioner Marshall Anderson and Commissioner Glenn Billings.
Our search revealed that in 1971 the inefficient fiscal practices probably
cost the taxpayers of Weld County over a quarter of a million dollIrs.
We all know how important it is to restse respect for authority for our
country and we all but wince at the lack of discipline so that is so
evident in our country's streets and campuses and we the member of the
Citizens Collition think it scandalous that public officials like you
should have to be asked to take action so fundamental to sound business-like
government and like that prophet of old we also ask how long oh Lord,
how long? Therefore as we continue to discuss with our legal counsel
the possiblity of future legal action and because of the urgency to
reform our county government in line with our citizens needs and sound
business practices we submit the following proposals for you immediate
implementation.
(1) Weld County Landfill, Evans - Is a mans word no longer
his bond. Are those contracts that you make with the people
of Weld County to be breached so easily. We are referring
to the sanitary landfill contract made and entered into
July 2, 1969, which states in paragraph 10 as follows:
ge cccl.,
710518
2 its
"So long as Landfill shall operate/certified dumps
in accordance with this agreement, the County shall
guarantee a gross revenue of $5,000.00 per dump so
certified, however, only after a complete audit of
the books of Landfill by the Count-; Auditor. Any
such payment or payments made by the County shall be
done immediately after July 1st of each anniversary
year of operation of each dump certified or as soon
as after practiciable.
The Citizens Collition therefore demands an immediate
audit by the County Auditor to acertain what you gentlemen
should have been certain of before paying the $12,000.00
of the taxpayers money to Weld County Landfill. That is
whether or not Landfill was really entitled to this
$12,000.00 payment under the terms of this contract.
The Citizens Collition also suggests an immediate review
of current rates at the dump because Weld County taxpayers
are paying a higher rate than citizens in such places as
Boulder and Fort Collings In as much as this landfill
is certified by the County - the County should supervise
its operation, therefore we request immediate implementation
state
of the/health department guidelines regarding solid waste
disposal sites, such as daily cover, fencing, proper drainage
bypassing the area, prompt construction of adequate through
the dump in case of back flooding of the Evans area.
(2) Decision making - the Citizens Collition proposed
immediate action on the following:
(1) that at least 24 hours prior to a County Commissioners
meeting that a complete working agenda be published
in a county newspaper with wide circulation.
(2) that all County Commissioners meetings be held
at a time leaning to be citizens participation
preferably in the evenings.
(3) that the County budget be published in its entirety
and that public hearings be held on the proposed budgets.
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(4) that sufficient time be alloted daring each meeting
for the presentation of public petitions which are
not on the agenda.
(5) that a manual of Standard Operation Procedures be
drawn up and put into effect immediately, thereby,
hopefully, putting an end to government operated by
seat-of-the-pants instince.
(6) that on matters affecting taxpayers residing considerable
distance from the Greeley area, the County Commissioners
hold meeting in town halls closer to those taxpayers
Fort Lupton and Briggsdale for example.
(7) complete printed records of minutes of all meetings
be kept on file and reaidly accesbile to the taxpayers
(8) that the Commissioners appoint a newspaper with wider
circulation as the official county paper - publish
county business so that information about county business
and decisions will be more readily available to all citizens.
3. Purchashing procedures - the Citizens Collition proposes
(1) that a complete file be kept on all purchases for
quotations
the county and that at least 3 bids in writting
be obtained on all purchases over $100.00.
(2) that all construction and equipment contracts over
$1,000.00 should have published public notice and
sealed published after the opening.
1(3) that all records be more readily accesible to the
taxpayer
(4) that the County use the State Purchasing Office on
all items where State prices are cheaper than bids
secured locally.
(5) that no County employee be allowed to accept gratuities
in any form from any supplier.
We request that the above policies be formalized and an official resolution
adopted by the Commissioners as soon as possible.
(4) Land Purchases - The Citizens Collition proposes the
following:
(1) that no purchases without appraisal by a licensed appraise:
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(2) that the County pay for only one appraisal
(3) that if there is more than one appraisal then the County
negotiate land purchases through the lowest possible
appraisal.
(4) that studies be made for land needs prior to land
purchases.
(5) that condemnation proceedings be used when negotiations
fail to purchase land at or near the purchase price
We of the Citizens Collition know that state laws do not require
County Commissioners in Colorado to do many of the things that were demanding
to be done but State laws are minimum restraints for standards for total
policy. To once again restore the faith of the:titizens of Weld County
in their County government is essential that you - the elected representatives
begin immediately to implement all the above sound business procedures.
In addition this action would enhance communication to the people so they
may actively share with you the decision making so vital effecting their
lives and their pocketbooks. We ask no more of you than a government
which truly involves and serves the people and we would ask that you
not delay - that you do it now.
Mr. Anderson: Clyde, everything in there has been done - as far as holding
meeting in Briggsdale or Fort Lupton - the law say this is the place.
Mr. Peddycord: Marsh thats right but it seems to me that you represent a lot
of people that are unfornatuate to be in a position that they are not
able to attend your meetings.
Mr. Anderson: The door is never closed here - it is duly published in the
newspaper. Anybody can walk in that door during the meeting without an
appointment and we have nothing to hide around here. As far as night
meetings the law says 10:00 o'clock in the morning on Wednesday.
Mr. Peddycord: This may be right.
Mr. Anderson: isn't that right - but we can not change State laws and
we can't satisfy a few people whims.
Mr. Peddycord: I don't think, Marsh, that this is a few people's whims - I
think that you represent the County's taxpayers in Weld County and the
more difficult the County makes it for those people to attend those
meetings the tougher it is for them to participate actively in their
government. The law needs to be changed. You could lead an assult
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on the State House to change the law. All we are saying is that
people who work for a living either have to take off and the boss
pays their salary for not being there or they have to do away with
the salary they would have made to attend your meetings.
Mr. Billings: Mr. Peddycord I would like to ask some questions - it
seems never to have been clarified whether you as an individual
are doing this or whether there are other people? I would like a
list of those people who belong to the Citizens Collition and I
think most of the people in the County ask for this list and I
understand in one of the newspapers that they refused to give this
list unless they did not publish it. If we are going to talk about
the requests that you have made here - we would like to know if it
is Clyde Peddycord or other people are involved - who are involved?
Mr. Peddycord: I certainly will endeavor to get a list for you, however,
if the accusation made are accurate then it doesn't really make any
difference if it is just Clyde Peddycord or a citizens collition.
Mr. Billings: I want to know if I am just talking to Clyde Peddycord
or whether there are other people involved.
Mr. Peddycord: Alright I will try to get a list.
Bill Elliott: Mr. Chairman, I was going to say when Mr. Billings said -
you are elected by several thousand people and we come in here with
a Citizen' Collitions and this isn't even signed by anybody. I just
wonder who we are talking about.
Mr. Peddycord: I will be real happy to sign your copy.
Mr. Elliott: We are real happy most of us the way the county government
is being run and we just wondering who is objecting to it - the county
government.
Mr. Sitzman: My name is Clarance Sitzman and I live right close to town
here in following things through here it kind of shakes me a little
bit that someone should do this. I have relatives living out at
Briggsdale and also have some in Fort Lupton and it so happens to be
that the type of business that I am in that they can come to town and
are in town more often than me. I think that little item is so
insignificant that it don't even ---- if we had hors;, and buggy days
it would be different.
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Mr. Brand: I am John Brand and I am a member of the Citizens Collition
I live at 1549 Twenty-ninth Avenue. I can leave my phone number if
necessary. I have been here for two years coming here from West
Texas - things are often a little puzzling I have spent some time
up here looking through your minutes and trying to discover what
has or has not happened. I find it just astonishing that the public
servants should have to be asked some of the questions that we have
asked you. I find it astonishing that we should have to ask you
if the government is to be for the people or if people are for the
government. It seems like this is a question that has been asked
time and again - Jesus asked the same question when he said is
man to serve the sabbath or is the sabbath to serve man? We know
that he decided that the sabbath and all human institutions are to
serve the people. So there are a few of us here now representing
the Citizens Coalition and I think the longer you folks postpone
action on these measures the more of us you will fine as members
of the Coalition.
Mr. Anderson: Are you going to college up here?
Mr. Brand: I beg your pardon?
Mr. Anderson: Are you a college student?
Mr. Band: No - thank you anyway - I teach literature at the University
of Northern Colorado.
Mr. Anderson: Thats what I thought.
Mr. Sitzman: Question Mr. Chairman, now you made the remark - you brought
in several times and kind of implicating with the Bible on this. You
say the sabbath well if you go that far what is the sabbath - Saturday or
Sunday? We happen to believe two different way also.
Mr. Brand: Mr. Anderson it shouldn't matter whenver it exists, whatever
it needs, institutions are to serve the people.
Mr. Anderson: For your information Clyde and I don't know who you represent
I have an idea I am sorry Andy Gurtner isn't here this morning - I would
like have him in on this. He is one of you, but everything in these
accusations, Clyde, I dont think you can back up a one of them and as
far as this advertising in the newspaper - the newspaper publications
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you people are misinformed on that. At budget time or at advertising
time t all the legal documents and everything is advertised for bids
the Greeley Booster has been low - $1.75 per column inch - I think
or $1.65 - correct me Mrs. Spomer if I am wrong. The slosest bid
if I remember right was $2.60 - waa't it - you talk about the money
how do you want your money saved?
Mr.Peddycootd: I think that you have to look at spending money as to where
Mr. Anderson: The law says ---you just got through saying take the lowest
bid - we take the lowest bid - it has been the policy for the last
20 years that I know of but all legal publications are in the Booster.
Mr. Peddycord: Maybe the policy should be changed.
Mr. Billings: We have also established the policy, Mr. Peddycord, that I
am sure that you are not aware of it has been in effect for over a
year and a half now - any land change, any zone changes, andy hearing
is also published in the newspaper in the area - when the zone change
or the hearing is to take place. I think there are records in there
regarding
to show that anything that has taken place in this/county zone change,
land transactions or anything is not only published in the legal
newspaper but also in the local newspaper within the area, whether it
is Keenesburg , Firestone, Ault, Eaton, where ever it prints - where
the local paper also prints.
Mr. Peddycord: Getting back to a statement you made Mr. Anderson, I would like
to have you look on page 1 at the bottom of the page where we put in here
and you have a copy of paragraph 10 of the Sanitary Landfill Contract
the copy that I have is photostated but I am sure that it is correct
and it is taken verbatum from the copy that I have signed by both
you and Mr. Billings approved as to form by Mr. Telep and according
to an interview that you gave somebody from the Town and Country News
you stated that the County had in effect paid Weld County Landfill
$12,000.00 now if your statement is correct and I checked personally
with Mr. Anderson, of the accounting firm, he said at the time I had
called him (4/27 at 9:05 in the morning) there had not been an audit
on Landfill Dump.
Mr. Billings: I would like to ask one question of you Clyde at this time
on this statement of yours here - you refer to Sanitary Landfill at Evans
this seems to be your main concern - is that true?
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Mr. Peddvcord: Well in what way, I think I am concerned---- about four isssues
Mr. Billings: You are concerned abut the. money - you name specifically the
Sanitary Landfill is this true?
Mr. Peddvcord: I think it is the main dump right now, however as I recall
the people who Landfill at Evans own 4 other dumps but we are talking
about Landfill Incorporated. I think with offices at Evans.
Mr. Billings: Just to clarify I think it should be brought out here that
Sanitary Landfill at Evans received no County reimbursement of any kind
whatsoever only those Sanitary Landfills outside of the area that are
serving the public as you say - Briggsdale or from Ault or Eaton or
Erie. The people where - these landfills were the only ones that were
supplemented with money and I think you will find under the Statutes
if you read them quite close, which I have done at great lengths,
that it states in there that the County has the responsibility to establish
a dump in the areas where they need them and there are provisions within
the Statutes that limits the amount of negotiation of the operation of the
dump also it has been found by this Board in trying to establish sanitary
landfills within the County that if the County is going to operate a
sanitary landfill thhmt-lees, with our manpower and equipment it would
cost $250,000.00 to buy equipment alone, with one large cat and one
large dozer, say a D-9 which is $110,000.00 and you are talking about
a compactor which is $85,000.00, your talking about 20 some men to
operate these dumps 6 days a week, you talking about 1 or 2 motor graders
about $38,000.00 a piece, a couple of carryalls - at least one at
$45,000.00 to $50,000.00 a piece and we are talking about 2 small6ozers
at $80,000.00 to go around to police these dumps. Now if $12,000.00
a year is costing the taxpayers of Weld County more than $250,000.00
a year plus salaries of the employees to operate these sanitary landfills
then I think maybe we are wrong; . But if you can prove to me that your
Committee can prove to me that $12,000.00 a year is more expensive than
$250,000.00 then I am ready to listen to you on sanitary landfills.
Mr. Peddvcord: Mr. Billings, I think you begged a point - I don't think
that we are talking about the money issue we are talking about the priciple
in which you paid $12,000.00 without having an audit of the books. Now
if in fact Weld County Landfill is entitled to the $12,000.00 then you
neither one know , I assume
have made a tremendous bargain but you nor V' as of - this minute
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whether or not Weld County Landfill is entitled to the $12,000.00 under
the terms of your contract, not mine, the terms of your contract.
Mr. Billings: I can also show you
Mr.Peddycord: I am also am amazed that accoring to Mr. Andersons statement
that Weld County Landfill serves the County so well with 5 dumps but
Mr. Anderson says it would cost us $200,000.00 at 18 dumps. Now it
seems to me that either Weld County Landfill is not serving it citizens
of the County and we are not getting a buy $12,000.00 or somebody is
not telling the truth when they say to me it is going to cost us
$200,000.00 to operate a dump. I am just asking questions.
Mr. Anderson: You know what happend in Jefferson County - do you know what
the expenditure was for one dump in Jefferson County? $347,000.00 to
create one dump - if the people of Weld County want to pay a mill and a
half to run the dump or shall we let the people pay who are using the
dump pay for it. Shall we go out here to Briggsdale and asses the land
a mill and a half for dumps for high populace areas or shall we go on
a pay as you go basis.
Mr. Peddvcord: Marsh, I am not arguing about the $12,000.00, as I said to
Mr. Billings - if in effect you have had the audit and you know that the
money should have been paid I will say great - you got a tremendous bargain
but you have not performed an audit - this is the point, not dollars.
Mr. Anderson: The hell it ain't dollars.
Mr. Billings: I would like to ask you some questions I think you have been
in numerous business in Greeley and in Weld County and I am sure that
whenever you have started out a business, those numerous ones that you
have been in, that it takes you a little time to establish and to see that
this business is operated the way it should be. Now if there is any
discrepancy within the payments to Landfill Incorporated, who operate the
dumps in Weld County, any discrepancies will be corrected, but it does
take time this County has come a long way in the last 2 years more than
most Countiesfiave come in the last 30 years, and going to an accounting
system within the Government where can tell you exactly what it costs
to build a bridge or a load of gravel or anything else and you can't
find another County in the State of Colorado that can do this.
Mr. Anderson: Well, Clyde in 1969 - January 1 we got settled with the
proposition of taking care of the trash with the no burining clause in
the law. We stated with an unknown factor nobody knew what was going on
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we had all the heavy thinkers around telling us what to do and the
equipment people were here with all the equipment to handle dumps.
It was the same situation we were in with the ambulance. Why haven't
you tied into the ambulance situation? We guaranteed a man $5,500.00
why don't you go int) that?
Mr. Peddycord: Did you say in this contract you wouldn't pay the $5,500.00
Mr. Anderson: It was an out and out payment because it was the cheapest
way to go.
Mr. Peddycord: Marsh, if you wouldn't have put in here paragraph 10 I wouldn't
find any fault with you. You told me as a taxpayer by gosh you were not
going to pay Landfill Incorporated one dime until you audited his books.
Mr. Anderson: There was an audit----
Mr. Peddycord: Have you audited his books?
Mr. Anderson: It is in the process now.
Mr. Peddycord: Has it been audited?
Mr. Anderson: Some of these dumps were opened until 1970.
Mr. Peddycord: Marsh, I don't care when these dumps were opened - it says
here that you were not to pay him one dime a£ the taxpayers money
until you audited his books. The books are not audited and the money
has been paid which is a violation of your contract. Now you can talk
about what a bargain you got - you may have I don't deny it but I at
lust saying you can't operate a business as big as Weld County with
taxpayers money - its not your money and its not my money - it belongs
to the taxpayer. I think that if you are going to have a contract and
if your word is to mean anything to the taxpayer of the County - if you
don't want to do it then don't put it in the contract.
Mr. Billings: This isn't any different Mr. Peddycord in the amount of degrees
that you made a charge in the paper that it was against the law to dump
car bodies or septic waste within a sanitary landfill. I think if you
will look at the state laws and also the article that was in the Greeley
Tribune regarding your statement that you were told incorrectly and totally
misinformed.
Mr. Peddycord: Mr. Billings that is not correct - if I may mention this.
Dr. Cleaver, Mr. Printz both said that the Health Departments interpertation
accept
of the 1967 law is that a dump operator may anything he want tcaccept
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In talking to Dr. Cleaver personally he said, Clyde, this has not been
tested in court and there are two ways in which you may interpert this
paragraph and we think that perhaps your way may be right also. Now
unfortunately we don't have the money..,..
Mr. Billings: Thats the Health Department - he works with the Weld County
Health Department and the State Health Department has informed this Board
and also the operator of Sanitary Landfill that these are permissible.
Mr. Peddycord: But until we get a court test we don't really know that this
is a legal interpertation, even more than my interpertation
Mr. Billings: It is still permissible until the court say different.
Mr. Peddycord: I have to agree with you. I have to agree that at the time
of our news release we were interpertating the State law to say this
and if the State law does not mean it then why did they waste all their
time to pass the law because I think they really meant to control solid
disposal site. Now somebody in our humble opinion is misinterperting
the law as you say we are misinterperting it. There are two sides to
each question.
Mr. Sitzman: Mr. Chairman, I have a question for myself I want to ask
Clyde had made a remark that you had give money before the books were
audited, my question for myself is, was the work done satisfactorily
to you three men at the time that you issued the money? The work that
you had done up to that time was it satisfactory?
Mr. Anderson: The County Sanitation Officer approved all the
Mr. Sitaman: In other worked for their money given. alright.
Mr. Billings: Their operation has been approved right along from the start.
I would like, Mr. Peddycord, to clarify this one statement of a quarter
of a million dollars up here I know that it was mentioned about the
purchase of this property over here. I assume maybe this is where he
is talking about the quarter of a million dollars and I would assume
Mr. Peddycord is very much misinformed about the purchase of the property
over here and the detail that went into the purchase of the property.
and when I refer to the property I mean the old Sterling block or the
Court House block. I would like for you to elaborate on that a little bit
and ma/be we can give you some answers.
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Mr. Peddycord: I assume that the amount of money published $340,000.00
is the amount you paid for it?
Mr. Billings: Right.
Mr. Peddycord: Is this correct?
Mr. Billings: That is correct
Mr. Peddycord: I believe you had one appraisal at $212,000.00 which
represents the difference there of $130 roughty some $120,000.00
some dollars so that is half of the quarter of a million that we
accuse you of wasting. I believe that Mr. Anderson said also that
you had another appraisal. But going from the low appraisal of
$212,000.00 there is $100 and some thousand dollars, we couldn't
understand why the County using taxpayers money would go out and
pay for three or four appraisals each one assendingly high, higher
than the other one. If you really needed the property so badly
and there was no study made that you did, in fact you just entered
into a contract with a firm to make a study to see if we need land
or need more buildings, then it is amazing to me how you spend the
taxpayers money and pay $340,000.00 on one appraisal at your request
said it was worth $212,000.00. Then another thing that I don't understand
or that we don't understand is the Citizens Coalition, how we could
appraise that property for $10,040.00 for tax purposes which is suppose
or 400 dollars for tax purposes which is suppose to represent under
State law approximately 30 percent of the sale value. Now if the
sale value should be in the neighborhood of $35,000.00 then we grossly
over paid for the land at about a tune of $305,000.00 which is fantastic.
I don' t know of any private operator who could do ,usiness in this
manner.
Mr. Sitzman: I would like to have a couple of words on this. You made a
remark that you didn't know how they knew they were going to need more
land. When I have livestock out there and I keep getting more I know
I am going to need corrals I don't need .an expert to tell me
that, correct? We are exploding our population everyday so after hearing
about this in the paper you put out by
Nelson, Haley, Patterson and Quirk, the man who so happened to sell this
ground to the County is my neighbor and I kind of hate to see him get
ridiculed like that.
Mr. Peddycord: I am not ridiculing him Mr. Sitzman.
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Mr. Sitzman: The Woolworths property over here the taxes on the Woolworths
property is a 1/3 of the valuation which you understand all of that
a 1/3 of the County valuation , is that correct,
Mr, Peddycord: It is suppose to be some 30 some percent of its resale value.
Mr. Sitzman: Alright or its assed value. Well now my question is to you
right over hera can you say that this land here is wort'i less than what
the land where the Woolworth Building sets - its more or less of equal
value - correct?
Mr. Peddycord: The land?
Mr. Stizman: Yes. yes the bare land.
Mr. Peddycord: The bare land - I would say, not being an expert, it is
real close.
Mr. Stizman: So right here I would like to present this- it may be passed
around - had my neighbor sold this land for what he was being taxed on
also for what he was being taxed on the land - not the building of
Woolworths he would have got the sum of $358,825.00. He argued and
discussed with Marshall Anderson and he got $320,000.00. They jewed
hii down that far and the assessed valuation here as published by
Nelson, Haley, Patterson and Quirk. Now maybe some valuator came
around and said here its only worth that much, well I will be dammend
if someone told me my farm was only worth so much and I was getting
taxed you think I would sell it cheaper. If his land is that valuable
that they are going to tax him that high on it, why should he take any
less money.
Mr. Peddycord: Mr. Sitzman I think you have .. the point
Mr. Sitzman: No I don't. I just don't approve.
Mr. Peddycord: The County Assessor carried that on the tax roll at 10,040
Mr. Sitzman: Right there is the last valuation maybe 20 years ago. That
right there is put out by one of our reputable firms Nelson, Haley,
Patterson and Quirk. besides that....
Mr. Peddycord: Now wait wait a minute - we are talking about 2 different
things, this is market value of the 1
Mr. Sitzman: Yes - okay
Mr. Peddycord: This is market value 107
Mr. Sitzman: True of what you are paying a tax on
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Mr. Peddvcord: he sold it for $340,000.00.
Mr. Sitzman: This is Woolworths that you are looking at - this little square
here is Woolworths - it is figured out the same. Look it over. But
nevertheless the man had to be agrued down on the price, and if he
is getting charged on the square foot tax valuation why should he sell
for less. I wouldn't. I don't think you would either Mr. Peddycord.
Mr. Elliott: I would like to ask Mr. Peddycord, how much property tax
do you pay a year?
Mr. Peddycord: What am I paying? At the present time I have just one
property and it is in the neighborhood of $534.00 I believe.
Mr. Elliott: We are paying $37,000.00 property tax per year and if it
weryn' t for the First National Bank loaning me the money I couldn't
pay it. And I think that theee people probably saved us 2 million
buck by purchasing this ground here because if they hadn't purchased
it they would have gone out to Clarence Sitzmans or someplace and
bought his farm and built a whole new complex on it, when they have
practically got everthing here except we just need a little more
ground.
Mr. Peddycord: Mr. Elliott, what you do with your money and what Mr. Sitzman
does with his money is no concern of mine or the taxpayers of Weld County
Mr. Elliott: I am talking about what these gentlemen
Mr. Peddycord: These gentlemen represent the taxpayers and they are using
the taxpayers money not their own money.
Mr. Elliott: I am one of those taxpayers and I am perfectly happy - I think
I pay too much taxes but I am perfectly happy in the way they are spending
it.
Mr. Peddvcord: Thats nice, I am glad you are - we are not.
Mr. Billings: I would like to bring out some more facts, Mr. Peddycord
I assume you have seen this - it is an appraisal of that property-
its on a page 8.5 by 11 its the appraisal that you have been referring
to it consists of less than, well actually 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 lines
of type. There is no way in the world this Board would every accept
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an appraisal such as that.
Mr. Peddvcord: Did you pay for the appraisal Mr. Billings?
Mr. Billings: The appraisal that you are based on - here is an appraisal
that is 76 pages long just let me quote a little bit out of this
appraisal. It seems to me that maybe your group failed to look
at a good standard appraisal. I would like to read the qualifications
of the appraiser, these are the qualifications of this appraiser.
The writer has engaged in valuation of residential
commercial, ranch, industrial and special purpose
property and the transfer of ownership, condemnation
work, ad valoreum tax and other purposes since 1947.
Valuation services and economic developments highest
and best use, multiple family dwellings these have
been rendered for the following:
Business area:
Life Insurance Company of Ohio. Life Insurance Company
Ohio National Insurance Company
Western Electric
Westinghouse Electric
Continental Oil Company
United States Steel Corporation
Humble Oil Company
General Mills Inc.
National Business Machine Corporation
Insurance Company of North America
Martin-Marietta Company
ITT Bell and Gossod
Univac Division of Sperry Rand Corporation
Gulf Oil Company
New York Life Insurance Company
Government Agencies
United State of America General Services Administration
State of Colorado - Department of Institutions
City of Golden,Colorado
City of Aurora,Colorado
City of Fort Collins, Colorado
Banks:
Denver United States National Bank
Denver First National Bank of Denver
First National Bank of Golden Colorado
Poudre National Bank of Fort Collins
Chase Manhatten Bank of New York City, New York
Central Bank and Trust Company of Denver, Colorado
First National Bank of Fort Collins, Colorado
Saving and Loan Associations
Silver State Savings and Loan Association Denver, Colorado
Golden Savings and Loan Association of Golden, Colorado
Great Savings and Loan Association of Boulder, Colorado
Fort Collins Federal Savings and Loan Association of Fort Collins
Equitable Savings and Loan Association of Sterling, Colorado
Loveland Savings and Loan Association of Loveland, Colorado
Others: Real Estate Firms. Private Clients, individual investors,
and Attorneys-at- Law.
He is an instructor at the University of Colorado in the Extension
Division of Adult Education. He is in land economics and real
estate appraisal
Member of the American Institute of Real Estate Appraisers
Society of Real Estate Apprisers
President of the Denver Chapter 9
1961 International Board of Governors
1969-71 Fort Collins Board of Realtors
Faculty of appraisal courses sponsored by the Society of Real Estate
Appraisers of North Dakota State University
Guest Lecturer at various conferences thoughout the United States
Admissions and Examination Committee of the Society of Real Estate
Appraisers Chicago, Illinois
There is still another page yet - this gentlemen went in and there is a
total appraisal of Greeley there you can tell what every piece of property
16
is valued at. There are four main factors which you use in appraisals
which were not used on the others.
Mr. Peddycords Was this the last appraisal you got?
Mr. Billings: This was the appraisal we got after we had to reject a very
inadequate, a very poor appraisal
Mr. Peddycord: Is this the appraisal that was finally gotten to justify
the $340,000.00.
Mr. Billings: This was the appraisal - we got two appraisals one from
the City of Greeley and one from outside the City of Greeley where
there was no interest related to the property at all.
Mr. Peddycord: I understood Mr. Anderson to say that you paid for three
appraisals.
Mr. Billings: This appraisal was made on these four things (1) time
adjustment size adjustment (2) market value (3) highest and best
use and (4) economic analysis. What we did was take three of the
major firms in the City of Greeley, the Greeley National Bank, the
First National Bank, and the Weld County Bank ( the United Bank of
Greeley) and these best fit an overall location of the operation of
the financial areas in Greeley. When he used all these factors he
came up with a square footage of this property at $11.60 per square
foot. The Greeley National Bank area he came up with $13.31 per
squire foot, for the First National Bank area $11.43 per square foot
and for the Weld County Bank area he came up with $8.60 per square
foot. Using the size factor and the time factor and the evaluation
factor and the highest and best use he missed the total valuation by
one or two cents a square foot. If you can find a more perfect appraisal
whole appraisal
o8 the/City of Greeley, than that/right there, then I would like to see it.
Mr. Peddycord: Based on that then have you requested the County Appraiser
to reappraise the downton property and reassess it for the tax purposes
of the County. I mean this apparently if it is true really says that
the downtown area is undertaxed. The thing that bothers me is why
did you go through two other appraisers before you came to this man?
If he is qualified and I don't question it.
17
Mr. Billings: Very simple. This appraiser was recommended as an outside
appraiser and this one was inadequate, inefficient, nobody, you wouldn't
accept that appraisal on your dog and you know that.
Mr. Peddycord: The thing is---
Mr. Anderson: Clyde, you ought to understand All of this you have a real
estate license.
Mr. Peddycord: Marsh, I just don't understand people playing with taxpayers
money - to get three appraisal and pay for them. If Mr.
Mr. Anderson: We are taling about a lot of money.
say
Mr. Peddycord: If Mr. Gilbert wanted to bring in an appraisal an/to you
look I won't sell the property to you for what your appraisal says
is the worth or what,ver and he brings then he brings in an appraisal
and you get together on it - fine
Mr. Billings: None of these are Mr. Gilberts appraisals.
Mr. Peddycord: Thats right, the County paid for three appraisals - why?
This is not standard procedure Mr. Billings for any-
Mr. Anderson: For $340,000.00
Mr. Billings: You just told us you wanted three bids on everything---
Mr. Peddycord: Three bids but not three appraisals ---
Mr. Billings: Its the same thing Mr. Peddycord: You mean to tell me that if I wanted to sell you a piece of
land for "X" number of dollars and you get an appraisal and I say I won't
sell it, okay I will run out and get another appraisal, you come back this
appraisal is $10.00 higher than the first one and I say Glenn I won't
sell it, then you go out and you get another appraisal and its $10.00
higher and I say Glenn it is within $5.00 and you say to me are you going
to accept this - don't I have a responsibility
Mr. Billings: I am talking about
Mr. Peddycord: don't I have the responsibility of getting the appraisal?
I am talking about the priciple involved - the principle Mr. Billings
the priciple involved. You caz 't operate a County business on taxpayers
money with this type of loose principles with this type of operating
practices.
18
Mr. Billings: I think that Mr. Peddycord you are making statements out
of context and that you don't really know a lot of the facts on this
and I think I should bring out a few more facts. Actually
Mr. Peddycord: Mr. Billings before we bring in anymore facts can we just
answer some of the questions.
Mr. Billings: I Link these facts should be brought out.
Mr. Peddycord: Oh alright.
Mr. Billings: _ Negotiations for this property ran over for approximately
eight months. I don't know if you are aware of it or not, the Advisory
Board was present who are reputable businessmen from all over the County.
These men were brougt in from different areas on this and it was a
unanimous decision of the Advisory Board of the Budget that this piece
of property should be bought and at that time negotiations had been
reached down to $350,000.00 and it was the thought of this Board that
it should be, the Advisory Board that it should be bought at that price.
These hearings happened here one of them - notes of meetings I took
myself on May the 14th regarding the aquisition of the land and you
made this statement also that it should be condemned - do you realize
that that piece of property over there has been under option for quite
some time for a considerable price above the $340,000.00 that we paid
and I think you will find that an attorney will tell you that once there
is an option on a piece of property at a certain price - this establishes
a condemning price for the property.
Mr. Peddycord: It didn't sell for that price did it?
Mr. 3illings: No it didn't.
Mr. Peddycord: Okay.
Mr. Billings: If we had of condemned it we would have very well been ordered
by the Courts to pay that price.
Mr. Peddycord: But you might very well not have been, correct?
Mr. Billings: We could have turned it down and went out and bought----
Mr. Peddycord: You could have also gotten a lower figure - possibly from a Court
couldn't you?
19
Mr. Billings: No---
Mr. Anderson: Clyde, you have been in the real estate quite a bit, you are
not in it now, but
Mr. Peddycord: I couldn't make a living at it Marsh, you know I am honest with
you.
Mr. Anderson: Well that is what I was afraid of - but I don't know if you
have ever had any property condemned - I have sat in several condemnation
suits and the best way to get your money is to go to condemnation on it.
All the highway condemnation - Joe Murphy is setting there and he will back
me up on this - from here to Denver. I never have seen one of t'iose go
below the highest appraiser.
Mr. Paddycord: Marsh it is amazing that the State Legislature establishes certain
rules and regulations for County governments, city governments etc and the
standard practice operated governments is to condemn property if they are
vitally needed if the price cannot be agreed upon. It is fantastic that
the County Commissioners of Weld County would pay for three appraisals
each one raising the price of which they were going to negotiate from.
I just persoaelly don't understand it.
Mr. Anderson: Are you just going out here and get one appraisal and say
that is the price from now on and sit on it.
Mr. Peddycord: I would say that if this is not agreeable with the seller
that he should get his own appraisal - why should the County pay for
the appraisal?
Mr. Anderson: I argued with you for years over the price of tires and you
know one reason I couldn't buy them from you was that you were always
too dammed high.
Mr.Peddycord: I never sold you any - I don't think.
Mr. Anderson: The hell you didn't.
Mr. Billings: I think something else should be brought out on this is the
fact there are two fact we have been talking about they are only heresay
not fact - you say this property isn't needed - that Weld County isn't
going to grow - there isn't any expansion. I would like to bring out some
points. This County in the next - in fact we have been'told that in 1972
we will have to supply three more Courts, another County Court, mother
District Court and a State Water Court to go in this building. The only
20
availability - available space within this building ^fight now
is the room you are sitting in, the room across the hall which
is part accounting and Mrs. Spomers and the downstairs which is
all Mrs. Spomers and if you will make a trip through the Services
Building you will find that people are standing on top of one
another now. If you note for the last three years we have had
an application in to the Presidents Crime Control Commission for
a new law enforcement complex which is completely outmoded, outdated
and does not meet any of the State or Federal requirements for a law
enforcement complex.
Along those same lines we started two weeks ago using our
4-H Building for hearings for our Planning Commission because we are
out of room there. We have investigated this throughly enough with
the County Commissioners in Larimer County and in Adams County and
you suggested that move County government all over. Larimer County
has offices in Loveland and in Estes Park and in Fort Collins and
is the dog gondest mess and they all say the same thing they
don't know where everything is part of it is in Loveland and part of
it in Fort Collins and part of it in Estes Park. Adams County has
spread theirs out and in both instance they have come back to us
with the only ideal efficient operation for County government is a
central location - with one complex that will serve all the people
that come to one area and do everything from getting a marriage licence
to a divorce, drivers license, seeing the Sheriff or anything else.
Mr. Peddycord: I think perhaps we have a lack of communication - I don't
think you h:_ard me say the County wasn't going to grow and I don't think
you heardme say that you should move your offices out to lessor areas
or smaller areas I think you heard me say that I suggest that you hold
your meetings in areas where taxpayers live so that they too can come
and discuss with you problems on their minds - not have to come into
Greeley - at no place did we recommend that you move your office, your
paper work or procedures outside the City of Greeley. Number two
Mr. Anderson: We could have gone out to Brijgsdale and bought an acres
of ground for $50.00
21
Mr. Billings: I would like to refer to the Briggsdale area I meet with
those people quite often and I know when you get out into the
Briggsdale area its harder for them to come into Briggsdale
a dozen or so than it is for them to get into one care and come
here. They have come here and have met with me - the people in
that area. The same as they do from Keenesburg of Hudson or that
area. They would prefer to coma !;o a central location and if we
were to hold a meeting in Briggsdale - a Board meeting of County
Commissioners - then our main population within this area - and who
is going to be hollering but the citizens who are paying the taxes
right here - in Greeley, Evans, LaSalle, Ault and Eaton.
Mr. Peddycord: Are you assuming that you are going to hold everyrheeting in
Briggsdale or one a year
Mr. Billings: Even one - if we met in Briggsdale concerning the problems
of the Greeley area for instance - we don't know from week to week
what is going to be on our agenda - because we get calls continually
maybe we can have a meeting set up in Briggsdale and it would totally
concern Greeley - now is this your idea of good government?
Mr. Peddycord: Is your government any different than other County government
that do this? I mean is it impossible for Weld County to be so unique
I find it hard to believe
Mr. Anderson: It sure is
Mr. Peddycord: Is it possible for Weld County to be so unique. I find it
hard to believe - if what you say 1s true that we need all this land
area and I am not questioning it - I think we need land area, I think
we have been takling about priciples which neither of you two gentlemen
have answered yet - we have skirted the issue - we have not answered any
of our accusations, brought up new theories, but if we really know that
we need this land and if we really know that we need to build a building
on it why would we' pay Nelson,Haley, Patterson and Quirk $12,900.00
to make a survey to tell us that we need it and if we don't need it
here - we didn't need the land.
Mr. Billings: They are not telling us if we need it and Mr. Peddycord you
are living today and you won't be here 20 years from now and neigh+ will
most of us here in this room but his Board is not going to sit here
and look at what we need today and not serve those people who are going
to be here 20 or 30 years from now.
22
Mr. Peddycord: Our ctitisium is why wasn't it made before you bought the land.
Mr. Billings: This study will show - we need this land right now - they only
thing this study will show is how many stories are we going to have to
build straight up to serve the people of Weld County on the land that
we have right now. And another thing that is required under the Federal
Control Crime Commission and the Governor's Crime Control Commission
where we have applied for it - the engineering and archetectual -
its an in-kind service and that in-kind service is land to put the
facility on. I think these are many things that you don't know in
your coalition and I don't know of any of your coalition being here
at any of our Board meetings and if you weee here at many of them
I think you would know a lot more about what goes on in this office
and be better informed than you really are.
Mr. Peddycord: I am amazed that you deny that our accusations on Page 1
of this referring to your contract with Weld County Landfill is
in accurate - you deny that it is not the truth - do you deny that
you paid $12,000.00 to Weld County Landfill? This is a fact, I don't
have to attend any meetings here to know this. I am not lying to you
these are records that you gentlemen made in the County. Well lets
answer it - is it truthful am _T misleading the people when I read this
to you.
Mr. Billings: I am asking you one question up here because your saying that
I misappropriated over a quarter of a million dollars.
Mr. Peddycord: I am saying the way in which you spent it is wrotg.
Mr. Billings: You are getting pretty close, if Mr. Telep would like to tell
you, you are getting awfully close on a
Mr. Peddycord: I don't think that- you can find or the coalition has accused
you of
Mr. Billings: that is what it says right here.
Mr. Peddycord: of theft or robbery or pilferage or dishonesty, we accuse
you of what we have said in the papers of the practice of doing imcomprehensible
things which are not legal. You violate your own contracts. Now thats
certainly under no set of circumstance be liable. You signed a contract
I didn't sign the contract, Mr. Telep signed it and said he approved it
as to form. Ann Spomer signed it as Clerk of the Board.
23
Bob Rav: I wonder if I could speak of that a moment. Did you sign
the contract?
Mr. Peddycord: No.
Mr. Rav: Are you saying that one party to a contract or two parties
to a contract can not get together and mutually agree to modify that
contract? In other words what is your complaint - that $12,000.00
was spent or the contract was modified.
Mr. Peddycord: I don't think it has been modified.
Mr. Ray: Well it has bean mofif'ed because they didn't follow
all the rules.
Mr. Peddycord: Is it in writting?
Mr.._JkY.L. Does it have to be in writing?
Mr. Peddycord: It would seem to me if you are dealing with taxpayers money
Mr. Rav: No, th-e taxpayers money - the $12,000.00 was paid. If
you think $12,000.00 was paid and paid properly is one point. Your
point is that they didn't stick to the written contract then you don't
have a valid point - they have a right to modify their written contract.
Mr. Peddycord: They didn't modify the contract.
Mr. Rav; They did modify the contract because they didn't do just
as exactly as
Mr. Peddycord: oh well then we don't need contracts - no I have had contracts
with people and I , wanted to get out of them and they took them to
their attorney - and they would say no-you can't do that because you
signed a contract. Why do we have contracts then.
Mr. Ray: Thats why we have it with the two parties involved. The
Commissioners and the other party - not for yours.
Mr. Sitzman: Clyde, I think you should remember that this $12,000.00
consists mostly of labor - your labor law can tie up anything - the
books weren't completely audited our officials indicated - they have
county
done a lot of work and is the ' going to ask'these men to hold up on
all that money - otherwords they are probably paying interest on their
24
equipment too. The work has been performed in other words we have
- they have done their duty - as this man said this was a mutual
agreement. Then I would like to go a little bit further. Besides
on this land over here you made the remark about too much money
being here and there - if something else goes in there and they
would have to condemn it do you realize it could cost the County
condemnation
100 to 150 thousand dollars more in o. tic:.. The land is there
we need - the population - you say why have experts - well experts
have told us the way the county is going to be in a few years.
So as far as that goes I want to take my hat off to the Commissioners
not only myself but a lot of my neibhbors, for some good thinking
and keeping a tight unit where it belongs and the man that owned it -
you would not have gotten it for a penny less. In a matter of fact
it wasn't more than a few months prior to that - that he told me he
would never take less than $400,000.00. The reason he dropped
because it County he and Marsh went on and on
about it and they got him to come down.
And another thing I would like to remind you of here
in California they wanted- they let it build up around and the
first thing the school board wanted to build a school and by the
time they got through comdemning the land , and this is public figures
back in California, you can check out - it cost over a million dollars
for the land alone, then they had to clear the land. We need this
our population is growing for it. As far as if I owned the thing
they still wouldn't have it because I can fight better than they can.
On top of Number 2 here, I think that is where I started
out - okay Number 2, paragraph 4 - sufficient time during each meeting
be allowed for presentation of public petitions which are not on the
agenda. All you have to do,my boy, if you call in here and ask for time
they will make it. I have set in this very room and Marsh and I will
go round and round for 2 or 3 hours at a time. I am not saying I agree
with him all the ` ne but anytime I have asked for some time hers those
fellows have given it to me. When - have wanted on figures on something
up here he has given them to me. Now lets turn over to the next page
still on number 2. That complete records of all minutes and meetings
be kept on file and ready for accesible access to taxpayers. It is
my fried - you come up here and you can get it anytime you want.
25
Then you go down to 8, appoint a newspaper with a wider circulation
so on and so forth - we can go to the Deriver Post. You say save
money - let the County Commissioners go to the Denver Post and
the few cents for
all of them - instead of/our local paper. Any interested person
is going to pick up that paper. You can even put it in Life
Magazine if you want - we will spend the County's money. Your
wanting to save money - then you want to go to a bigger paper to
save the money.
Then you go down to Number 3, that a complete file be
kept of all purchases of the County up to $100.00. In my operation
I can go down to the repair store and I can assure you I can put
in a little paper sack $100.00 worth of stuff, if I have bearing and
so forth. If their men aren't qualified to go down and take a purchase
order and buy stuff and equipment they need and come up here and get
it and make 3 copies, spend a lot of money so that you could come in
here some nite and see what its like and let it go at that - a $300.00
purchase the route you want to take could end up cost the taxpayers
another $25.00 per purchase. They have a total expense and you know
yourself that bearing can cost you $100.00 and here you want to go to
all that rigamoroll on that.
Number 4, that the County use the State Purchasing Office
I want to ask any of you here in this room - we have good reputable
businessmen and I will assure you on any bids they are going to come
close to State purchasing office and at the same token our reputable
businessmen in Weld County - who in the world is paying these taxes but them.
Can't we compromise - we will say a big truck is going to cost us -
lets say we go to Garnsey and Wheeler and buy 2 trucks - maybe through
the State Purchasing Office we can get them at another $25.00 cheaper
who is paying thousands upon thousands worth of taxes - our local
merchants or the State Purchasing Office? Our we going to compromise
or are we going to chop off the hand who feeds us. If you have a little
bit of problem with a truck here - what he going to do eall back to the
Ford Company - and say where shall I take it too - No. He is going over
to Garneey and Wheeler and raise heck and he is going to get what he needs.
26
I don't know I marked up some more but I had better get out
of here before I get mad. That will do it for now. But I really think
the Coalition Committee with them thinking that you have done right
I believe that you felt that you have but you didn't chebk deep enough
and the different circumstances of which you complain and list after
list which I read you being in different organizations and living
close to the State Highway - working with County, fighting with the
County - but I have never said - whether Marsh and I get along or
not - there have been times here when I think Betty thinks we are
going to get up and fight. I don't say that I agree with them all
the time but I don't say that they are so low to put in the paper
that they should quit their jobs. I might ask this are you looking
for a job?
Mr. Peddycord: It might not be a bad idea - I am sure it pays more than
I make
Mr. Sitzman: Well I am not quite sure that
Mr. Elliott: Mr. Chairman, I would suggest that Mr. Peddycord - when
their time is up and if they run or if they don't - I would suggest
that he put his name on the ballot and run for Commissioner - that
would be the way to settle this thing - then he might find out how
the things were going.
Mr. Peddycord: I am amazed at the opposition of he principle of federal
government in which there is a dispute about the fact that people are
entitled to face their representatives across a board - there may be a
difference of opinion and I am sure there is and I hope there always
will be but I do not like to be accused of harrasing people and accusing
them of being wrong when this is perfectly within the right of every
citizen within this country - it is one of the things that make this
country great
Mr. Stizman: Ar,e you accusing me of being wrong when I say that these men
have cooperated on these things i have read off.
Mr._Peddycord: That is your opinion.
Mr. S:zman: Alright - that is your opinion
Not Audible
Mr. Peddycord: I can speak for the coalition
Mr. Sitzman: sure you can
27
Mr. Peddycord: that a few people who have the courage to publish their
ideas in a newspaper - not hiding behind any bushes in fact we are
here today - in public form - public discussion - trying to make
recommendations that we feel sincerely are necessary to establish
the faith of a lot of taxpayers in Weld County and in the faith
in their government.
Mr. Sitzman: I am not saying you are wrong there but what I am saying
is why out of the clear blue sky you ask two men, that have worked hard
here and in the way
Mr. Peddycord: because I think they are imcompetent - thats why
Mr. Sitzman: Well
Mr. Peddycord: I think they are doing busines illegally -
Mr. Sitzman: Why are you asking them to be fired before you prove any
of these facts? After this meeting have I picked up the paper tonight
you feel that I will be fired - after tonight I wouldn't think nothing
of it - but you up and began to poison minds before these facts were
brought out. Now after this meeting and tonight you would put it in
the paper I wouldn't have thought too mach about it.
Mr. Peddycord: Well I don't think we did this.
Mr. Sitzman: oh yes you did.
Mr. Peddycord: I believe we asked the County Commissioners to resign - two
of them not Mr. Ashley. I believe that we gave the issues in which we
believed.
Mr. Sitzman: without any proff and without a hearing - without letting
them defend themselves.
Mr. Peddycord: You are saying things to me without any proof.
Mr. Sitzman: Oh - when I do something that is proof mister.
Mr. Anderson: Charley Baumgartner has something to say back there.
Mr. Marich: I would like to say something because I have another appointment.
I would like to express my feeling here. I am personally astounded
Mr. Peddycord - I am astounded at you action at asking for the resignation
28
of Mr. Anderson and of Mr. Billings. I think you just made a statement
about pressure and I serve in another capacity - the capacity in serving
the people of Weld County with School District #6 and being just a new
member myself, sitting in this position, we make judgements, every
decision you make is judgement. So what you people are doing is questioning
judgement and I know they are all different facets in the way you look
at it but judgement is judgement. I per;o:lally feel that in my 24 years
that I have lived in Weld County that these gentlemen have done a good
job, an'outstanding job, I think we will look back 10 years from now
and see that this property on the south side was a wonderful buy.
I know the little real estate work I have done here in the last year
in the decision that we make and spending 100,000.00 we look babk and
this is just a year ago . We look back and now say my ha=vens well
heavens 10 years ago that is the best thing we ever did.
These things are just a question of judgement. When you ask
for a resignation of these gentlemen right here I think you were wrong,
and that your group is wrong. I think you can question them, I think
you can come up to the meetings you can sit and disnuss these things
and these items whatever they may be - but whenever you aks for a
resignation I just think you are completely out of line.
Mr. Peddycord: This is a gentle thing to do - we could have done several
other things
Mr. Marich: Gentle----you call that gentle? You sit up here and do the
job that you think is right and then someone comes and asks for your
resignation---
Mr. Peddycord: If you know the other options that are available to citizens
Mr. Marich: I am not going to argue I don't know - I will not argue I am
only going to state Mr. Chairman - so all I am saying is that I am behind
you 100 percent - I am willing to help you in this cause and I am sure I
can get some other people to do the same thing - let the silent majority
stand up and be counted - and I am one of those.
Mr. Anderson: Th? k you Rudy. Charley Baumgartner.
29
Charley Baumgartner: I am from Keenesburg and I pay well over $6,000.00 in
taxes and I don't think it is in the best interest to have a meeting
in every part of the County to take their books to my part of the
County in Keenesburg - here is the place to have the meeting. It
costs less and you have all records here. I don't think this is
just a minor deal here. I never looked into what you paid for it
but in owning real estate and owning farms over the last 10 years
I know that it has been a good investment and <now that we need
thjis property regardless of cost. Whether there was anything under
the table or not.
Mr. Anderson: We haven't been accused of that I was waiting for that one.
Mr. Baungartner: Speaking for a taxpayer and we voted these people in whether
they ire good or bad we leave them right there until their term runs out.
Mr. Anderson: Is there anything more to come before this Board for the good
of the cause?
Mr. Sargent: I am Wes Sargent and I serie on the Advisory Committee
for the County Commissioners and one of the members of the 21 men.
I dislike, as Rudy said the procedure of going in to this asking for
the resignation of the Commissioners. There are several things
Clyde that I can see - if you had been on some of these committees
that you get a lot broader view of what you have to do. Now as
far as saving a quarter of a million dollars - we got a little
project going here for three years that cost you a quarter of a
million dollars each year. But I tell you baby you can't get rid
of it. Its tought we are working on it we have all worked on it
and the commissioners have worked on it.
In our ;ommittee alone, if your coalitions people - if you
would have checked earlier you would have found a 21 man committee
saved 5 mills working with the County Commissioners right here at
budget and this is the freedoms that you are talking abutt. Sitting
down with Mrs. $pourer and each department head and saying alright
first we are interested only in your needs not your wants. We have
got to save money for the taxpayer. We worked on this 100 percent
this was our primary interest all the way.
Also the same thing on this property there was no other
way to go. You have got to have centralized government on a ten year
period you know this as well as I - consequently we had no other place
to go. We set over an eight month period. We had all the law advise
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that we could possibly have. We went through the tax assessor
we did everything that you people are saying that should have
been done. It was all done and I as you did not want-to pay
that mucn for it but all of a sudden your hands are tied, but
for the good of Weld County and the good of the community this
committee did vote and decide and told their Commissioners and
advised them as such - that we did agree with them that they
should buy the property as soon as possible. As far as tantifill
goes I was not on any of those committees so I can not disagree
with agree with you. But the first thing I want all the coalition people
to know that 21 men and these were not just Greeley businessmen
if you have an argument with them - they were all out of the County
I see some of the gentlemen back them from Keenesburg, and from
Eaton, Ault and all around. The committee was made up from all of
these people and they did sit there and they saved you money. Every
budget we tore apart page by page - we gave Bart here all kinds of
fits, we gave Ann Spomer fits, we gave everybody fits but when
we got through we had saved 5 mills, now whether we are right
or wrong on the long haul we cant argue this with you or the
County Commissioners. We may be 100 percent right or if things
go so that in the County things will be depressedswhy that property
over there could be the worst deal possible, but we worked exactly
as you people - we were trying to save taxpayers money and at
anytime with our arguments did we ever come with anything asking
for any resignation and I don't see how - your group and our group
both on the same purpose of saving money and I just don't see your
point in asking for this. Now as some other gentlemen mentioned
there is argument both ways. We argued with them and there were
times when Marsh would be so mad at me for 10 days he wouldn't
speak to me. But we would sit back down at this table and we worked
it out and as I•say the big point of this 21 man advisory committee
saved the taxpayer 5 mills. If allowed to go you would have paid
23 or 24 mills and we had lawyers also to sit with us every m?ttng
and we would call in qualified people. They would tell us they would
have to have certain bridges and we would have qualified people tell
us what a certain bridge would cost and there was lots of hours
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and work put into this by just like the other people and hour
after hour and night after night. I agree with you we all want
to save taxes but as far as you acting for the resignation of
any of the County Commissioners I feel you are way way out
and I would go on record as to disapproving this technique
entirely - the type of hearing we have to go throug'-i when none
of us have ever been heard before - the 21 man committee that
sat there and took care of your tax money. Thank you.
Mr. Anderson: We have a meeting at 1:30 I think that if there is
more
nothing/to come before this Board - Clyde I hope we have heard
you out. The door is always
Mr. Peddvcord: Marsh I appreciate
Mr. Anderson: the door is always open - we don't have any closed meetings
but.
Mr. Billings: I would like to bring up one thing Marsh, I would like Clyde
to sit down something wit'- U . Buss with the County audit we have been
praised by the State Auditor, by everybody you can think of in the
State of Colorado. This system is being adopted in lots of areas
we are working with the State on it with the State Revenue people
right now anal going into a more complete system than we have got
but when we break it down so close - I have 31 missile bases in
roads
my territory - live ones that have to be maintained/And in operation
24 hours a day and when we break this down so tight that everyone of
these 31 missile bases were listed and everytime one of my motor
grader men or service men work on one of these roads the federal
government is charged - I dont' think there is anyway in the world
to get a tighter system in govenment than we are developing.right now
and it is going to take a few more years to get it complete. You can
look through this and you know exactly what it costs to build a bridge
at Keenesburg or at Briggsdale or Stoneham or New Raymer. It is here
and this has neve.' Ueen done anywhere else and it is as complete accounting
system. I don't think your group has even looked at this - I don't think
they have even asked about it. I think before you make any accusations
poor county government, or poor city government you should come before
us - long before you come out with your statement and sit down and we
will show you. We make mistakes - you have made a lot of them yourself
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in business there is no question about it. If we got any mistakes
that have been made we will correct them. Wka are glad for any
guideance but some of t`ie accusations that you made as far back
as -- they were completely out of line - they didn't disturb me
greatly - I don't think we made any accusations of your group.
No sir - we would like to know who your group is and to meet with
them. I think the things that were brought out today were good.
Mr. Anderson: The time has just clicked over.
Hello