HomeMy WebLinkAbout680368.tiffBEFORE THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
WELD COUNTY, COLORADO
APPLICATION OF LEO K. WARDMAN, )
d/b/a LEO'S HUT, for fermented )
malt beverages (3.2% Beer) license.)
REPORTER'S TRANSCRIPT
Greeley, Colorado
July 3, 1968.
APPEARANCE S:
MR. THOMAS A. RICHARDSON, 922 1/2 9th Avenue,
Colorado,
MR. SAMUEL S. TELEP,
on May
Greeley,
appearing for the Applicant.
Attorney at Law, Greeley, Colorado,
appearing as County Attorney for the
Board of County Commissioners.
Pursuant to Notice published in the Greeley Booster
31 and June 21, 1968, hearing on the above application
for license was
held in the District Court Hearing Room,
Fourth Floor of the Weld County Courthouse at Greeley,
Colorado, on Wednesday, July 3, 1968, at the hour of 2:00
o'clock p.m., before the Board of County Commissioners,
HAROLD W. ANDERSON, Chairman, and MARSHALL ANDERSON and
EDWARD L. DUNBAR, members of the Board.
CHAIRMAN HAROLD ANDERSON: I will at this time
turn the hearing over to our County Attorney, Mr. Telep.
MR. TELEP: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
At this time we would like the record to show that
this cause came on regularly to be heard by the Board of
County Commissioners of the County of Weld, State of
Colorado, at the hour of 2:00 p.m. on July 3, 1968, as
provided in the Notice of Hearing as was duly published
as required by law.
Let the record further show that this application
is being made by Mrs. Leo K. Wardman, d/b/a Leo's Hut,
Carr, Colorado. The application is for a fermented malt
beverage (3.2 Beer) license for consumption off the premises
only, at a location more particularly described as follows:
The East half of the Southwest Quarter of the Southeast
Quarter of Section 20, Township 11 North, Range 66 West of
the 6th Principal Meridian, Weld County, Colorado, on High-
way 85, four miles east of Carr, Colorado.
Let the record further show that the chairman of
the Board of County Commissioners, Harold W. Anderson,
presided, and that present also were Edward L. Dunbar and
Marshall H. Anderson, the other two members of the Board of
County Commissioners; also present was the County Attorney,
Samuel S. Telep. The applicant appeared in person and by
her attorney, Thomas A. Richardson.
I would like the record to further show that if
there are any protestants in the room, that they will have an
opportunity to identify themselves and to present any evidence
that they may have against the granting of this license to
this applicant, Mrs. Wardman.
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We would like the record to further show that the
Board of County Commissioners, after being petitioned by the
petitioner to designate an area to be served by this outlet,
after much study decided to set the neighborhood of this
location, and the legal description will be as follows:
The south half of Township 12 North, Range 67 W
of the 6th P.M., being sections 19 through 36, all of Town-
ship 11 North, Range 67 W of the 6th P.M.; all of Township
10 North, Range 67 W of the 6th P.M.; the South half of
Township 12 North, Range 66 W of the 6th P.M., being
Sections 19-36, and all of Township 11 North, Range 66 W of
the 6th P.M., all of Township 10 North, Range 66 W of the
6th P.M. and also the South Half of Township 12 North,
Range 65 W of the 6th P.M., being Sections 19-36, and all
of Township 11 North, Range 65 West of the 6th P.M., and
all of Township 10 North, Range 65 W of the 6th P.M.
Now, this is the area that has been designated as
the neighborhood of this location sought to be licensed.
We would also like the record to show and I would
like to mention at this time that those people who do not own
property in the area, or who do not manage a business in the
area, or who do not live in the area as has been designated
by the board, that their testimony won't be given any weight,
really, because it will be considered irrelevant and immaterial
and the Supreme Court has stated in its decisions many, many
times that it does not like to have the record just over-
whelmed with evidence that is not germane to the issue. They
like to have people live in the area testify, perhaps those
who frequent or would like to frequent the business, but other
than that, they don't like to have people from the other end
of the county testify to whether a location is desirable or
not in the northern end of the county. This is done so
that the record will not be cluttered with evidence which
should not even be considered, in the first place.
Mr. Chairman, you may take over. Perhaps the
petitioner or counsel for petitioner would like to make an
opening statement, or might forego that.
THE CHAIRMAN: Very well. At this time we will call
on the attorney for the petitioner.
MR. RICHARDSON: As the county attorney has told you,
this is for a 3.2 license, a carry -out license, and the con-
tents will not be consumed upon the premises. Mrs. Wardman
also has a 3 -way license on these premises at this time, and
of course, will retain that license. We would like to have
the Commissioners allow the file that is now in your possession
to become a part of the record. There are many items in
there that are not contested, but should be a part of the
record, and this we would request.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you. I will accept it.
MR. RICHARDSON: At this time we would like to call
Mrs. Wardman.
MRS. LEO K. WARDMAN,
Petitioner herein, called as a witness by and in her own
behalf, having been first duly sworn, was examined and
testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. RICHARDSON:
Q. Please state your name to the Commission.
A. Mrs. Leo K. Wardman.
Q. Where do you reside, Mrs. Wardman?
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A. Carr, Colorado. Four miles east, it would be.
¢ Approximately how long have you lived in this area?
A. 29 years.
Q. Do you presently hold a liquor license from the
County of Weld and also the State of Colorado?
A. Yes.
Q. How long have you held this license?
A. 8 years.
Q. Are you here applying for a 3.2 beer license to
carry out?
A. Yes.
Q. And do you understand that if this license is granted,
that none of this beer will be consumed on the premises?
A. That's right.
(Whereupon documents were marked for identification as
Applicant's Exhibits A, B, C, D, E, F and G.)
Q.
I hand you what has been marked Applicant's Exhibit A.
Would you tell the Commission what that is?
A. This was my poster that I had in my front window that
I was supposed to post for all this time.
Q. This was the notice of this hearing, and of the fact
that you were applying for this license; is that correct?
A. Yes.
Q. Did you prepare that notice yourself, Mrs. Wardman?
A. Yes.
Q. And in preparing that notice did you follow the
wording that was published in the newspaper?
A. Yes.
Q. I hand you what has been marked Applicant's Exhibit
F. Would you tell the Commissioners what that exhibit is?
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A. This is a notice that I had posted in the paper.
Q. Did you receive a bill on that notice?
A. Yes, and it is paid.
Q. Was this notice in the Greeley Booster?
A. Yes.
MR. RICHARDSON: I would like to have this admitted
in evidence.
THE CHAIRMAN: Accepted.
Q. (By Mr. Richardson) Mrs. Wardman, I hand you what
has been marked Applicant's Exhibit B. Would you tell the
Commission what that is?
A. That is my territory for my area that the County
Commissioners outlined for me.
Q. They referred to that as the "neighborhood" from
which this license would serve, is that right?
A. Yes.
MR. RICHARDSON: If the Commission please, we would
like to have this entered into evidence.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Accepted.
Q. (By Mr. Richardson) I hand you what has been
marked Applicant's Exhibit E. Would you tell the Commissioners
what this is?
A. This is a letter that was sent to you, my attorney,
from the county attorney, Sam Telep.
Q. And does this letter describe the area also?
A. Yes.
Q. Does this letter also state that you have complied
with the law up to this point?
A. Yes.
MR. RICHARDSON: We would like to have this entered
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into evidence.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Accepted.
Q. (By Mr. Richardson) I hand you what has been
marked Applicant's Exhibit G. Would you tell the
Commission what this is?
A. This is a drawing of my place as it stands, and
this up here will be where I would like to have my outlet.
Q. Did you help in drawing this picture?
A. Yes.
Q. Who will do the construction or supervising the
construction of this building?
A. My husband, Mr. Wardman.
MR. RICHARDSON: We would like to wait before we
present this in evidence, until Mr. Wardman has testified
as to how this structure will be built.
Q•
(By Mr. Richardson) Mrs. Wardman, did you have
occasion to have certain checks circulated and signed?
A. Yes.
Q. I hand you what has been marked Applicant's Exhibit
D. Would you explain to the Commission what that is?
A. This is my petition for the people to sign that was
for me.
Q. Did you see those people sign this petition?
A. Yes, I did.
Q. And did you see them put their addresses on?
A. Yes.
Q. On this particular one I had noted there were three
addresses there saying "General Delivery, Cheyenne, Wyoming."
Would you explain to the Commission why this address was
used?
A. Well, they get their mail there, but they live in
my territory, and they are residents of Carr, and they vote
in Colorado. They are Colorado residents; they are in my
territory.
Q.
I hand you Applicant's Exhibit C, and if you would
tell the Commission what that is?
A. That is some more of the folks that signed for my
petition, and they are in my territory.
Q. You saw these petitions signed?
A. Yes.
Q. You were the instigator incptting them signed at your
-place of business?
A. Yes.
Q. All these people, to your knowledge, live within the
area as defined by the Commission?
A. Yes.
MR. RICHARDSON: We would like to have these exhibits
C and D entered in evidence.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Accepted.
(By Mr. Richardson) You have lived in the area many
Q.
years and you have had your present license for approximately
eight years. Are you well-acquainted with the territory as
outlined by the Commissioners?
A. Yes.
Q. Could you tell the Commissioners how far it is to the
nearest outlet of this type to the east of you?
A. 30 miles.
Q.
30 miles to the east to the nearest beer outlet; is
that right?
A. Yes.
Q. How many miles is it to the south to the nearest
outlet?
A. Between 14 and 15.
Q. Would that be Pierce, Colorado?
A. Nunn.
Q. How far to the west is it?
A. About eight miles.
Q. Does that bring you to the outlet or to the county
line?
A. That is the finish of my territory, and then to Larimer
County.
Q. And how far to the north is the nearest outlet?
A. Well, it would be 7 to the line, and 17 to Cheyenne
from our place.
Q. Cheyenne is the nearest outlet of this type?
A. Yes.
Q. Do you have any idea how many square miles this
comprises, this area?
A. Close to 270.
Q. In that area there is no other outlet of this type.
A. No.
Q. Do you own the premises on which this outlet owuld
be located?
A. Yes.
Q. Will you be the operator?
A. Yes.
Q. And so all the finances and so on will be carried by
you, personally?
A. Yes.
(Discussion off the record.)
Q. Mrs. Wa rdman, would you give your given first name
9
please?
A. Leo.
Q. That is not your husband's name. That is your given
name?
A. That is my given name.
MR. RICHARDSON: Thank you. You may step down. We
would like to call Mr. Wardman.
FLOYD V. WARDMAN
called as a witness by and on behalf of the Petitioner,
having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified
as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. RICHARDSON:
Q.
State your name to the Commission, please.
A. Floyd V. Wardman.
Q. Where do you reside?
A. Carr, Colorado.
Q. Are you the husband of Mrs. Leo Wardman?
A. I am.
Q. She is the applicant here this afternoon?
A. That's right.
Q. Mr. Wardman, are you acquainted with the area in which
the Commissioners have defined as the neighborhood?
A. I believe I am.
Q.
Wfhout repeating, do you agree with the mileage your
wife just gave concerning the nearest outlets to the east,
south, north and west?
A. Might be a slight correction west. I think it is
actually 9 miles west before you find another outlet, and it
is in another county.
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Q. Larimer County?
A. Right.
Q. If this license is granted, where on the present
premises will the outlet be located, and describe to the
Commissioners what type of outlet it will be.
A. I expect to build a frame building attached to the
present building and have a serving window, and we don't
expect to have anyone within the building itself. All of
the merchandise we serve through this service window is
strictly carry -out and that is the way we intend to operate
it.
Q.
Why haven't you begun construction at this time?
A. I didn't know what the decision was going to be.
Q. If the decision is favorable, will you begin
construction immediately?
A. Yes, sir. The sooner the better.
Q. How long do you think it would take to construct
this type of structure?
A. If I get the right party and get going on it, it
would never be over three or four days. If he goes right, it
should be about two.
Q. One other thing, Mr. Wardman. Will this be located
on the east side of your present building?
A. Yes.
Q. You have been there with your wife in her other
business. Have you had any inquiries concerning a 3.2 beer
outlet?
A. No.
Q. Have you had people ask whether they could buy it
to take out?
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A. Oh. We have them every day.
Q. Is this the reason why you and your wife have
applied for this license?
A. That's right.
Q. Am I to understand, then, that you have had inquiries
every day for a 3.2 carry -out facility?
A. That's right.
MR. RICHARDSON: Would the Commission care to inquire?
At this time we would offer Exhibit G into evidence.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Accepted.
(By Mr. Richardson) You did help prepare this drawing
that is marked Exhibit G?
A. I have to confess I did.
MR. RICHARDSON: That's all. You may step down,
Mr. Wardman.
At this time I would like to call Mr. Wigfield.
HOMER WIGFIELD,
called as a witness by and on behalf of the Petitioner,
having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified
as follows:
Q.
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. RICHARDSON:
Q. Please state your name?
A. Homer Wigfield.
Q. Where do you reside?
A. Carr, Colorado.
Q. How long have you resided in this area?
A. This last time about four years, and about four years
before this.
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¢ You realize that Mrs. Wardman is here applying for
a 3.2 carry -out beer license?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you have an opinion as to whether or not there is
a need for such a license in the area?
A. Yes, I do. I stop there every day.
Q. Would you state to the Commission what your opinion
is as to the need?
A. Well, like I say, I stop there every day and buy all
my gas there and I have to wait before I go to work in
Cheyenne. There are customers come in and ask to buy carry-
out beer.
Q. If such a license were granted, would you buy your
beer there?
A. Yes, sir, I sure would.
Q. Are you acquainted with the area?
A. I sure am.
Q. Would you agree with Mr. and Mrs. Wardman on the
distances that they gave to the other nearest outlet?
A. I certainly would.__
Q. That those distances are approximately correct?
A. Yes.
MR. RICHARDSON: That's all. You may step down.
I would like to call Mr. Diehl.
JUNIOR W. DIEHL,
called as a witness by and on behalf of the Petitioner,
having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as
follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. RICHARDSON:
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Q. Will you state your name to the Commission?
A. Junior W. Diehl.
Q. Where do you live?
A. About a mile south of Carr.
Q. You have been in the area, lived in the area approxi-
mately how long?
A. About 19 years.
Q. You know, of course, that the Wardmans are here
asking for a 3.2 carry -out beer license. Do you have an
opinion as to whether this license should be granted?
A. I think it whould be granted.
Q. Why should it be granted?
A. I heard them come in and ask for beer to go and
I would use it myself if it was available.
Q. Have you heard these requests many times?
A. I don't stop there too many times, but I have heard
it.
Q. If this license were granted, you, however, would
buy your beer there?
A. Sure, I would.
Q.
Do you agree on the mileage that was given by the
other witnesses as far as the nearest outlet is concerned?
A. Yes, sir, I do.
MR. RICHARDSON: Any questions of this witness?
Mr. Diehl, you may step down. I would like to call Mr. Ivy.
ARNOLD IVY,
called as a witness by and on behalf of the Petitioner, having
been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. RICHARDSON:
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4.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
Would you please state your name to the Commission?
Arnold Ivy.
Where do you reside, Mr. Ivy?
In the town of Carr.
How long have you lived there?
In the town of Carr I lived 13 years.
I will ask you the same question: You realize Mr.
and Mrs. Wardman are here applying for a 3.2 beer carry -out
license. Do you have an opinion as to whether or not this
license should be granted?
A. Well, it should, I think.
Q.
Do you have an opinion as to whether or not there is
a need for this license in the area?
A. They stop every day and ask for carry -out beer. I
have heard that.
Q.
In your opinion you would feel there is a need for a
license of this type?
A. Yes.
Q.
Would you buy your beer there if you were to use it?
A. If I was buying beer, that is where I would buy it.
Q.
Do you feel this would service the community if such
a license were granted?
A. It would.
4.
You heard the other people testify as to the distances
to the nearest outlet. Do you agree these distances are
correct?
A. It is petty close.
4.
All right, sir.
MR. RICHARDSON: Any questions from the Commission?
MR. DUNBAR: Do you have any estimate of the total
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number of residents residing in this proposed area?
A. No, I don't, myself. They come and they go and there
is more moving in now, so I don't know how many is in there
now.
MR. RICHARDSON: That's all we have for this witness.
You may step down. We would like to call Mr. DePorter.
ARTHUR T. DePORTER,
called as a witness by and on behalf of the Petitioner, having
been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. RICHARDSON:
Q.
Please state your name?
A. Arthur T. DePorter.
Q. Where do you reside?
A. Right there a half a mile from Rockport. Been there
41 years.
Q. You should be pretty well acquainted with the area.
A. I hauled the first load of rock for Rockport after
Lone Tree burned down, in 1927.
Q. Do you have an opinion as to whether there is a
need for this type of license in this area?
A. Every time we have a gang, this is the thing they
want-- you know, they want to go for some beer. Another
thing, I am in there pretty nearly daily for gas and oil. If
they find out they can't buy any beer, they throw the potato
chips back on the counter.
Q. If you were buying beer, would you buy your beer there
if this license is granted?
A. Yes.
Q.
Would this keep these fellows at the ranch or in the
area, rather than driving clear out of the area?
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A. Absolutely. You can't hire anybody now unless they
can have a pickup to go to Cheyenne and then in a week or
ten days you have a damage suit against you. Even as far
as Denver I have had them.
Q. You would be in favor of having this license granted?
A. It is getting to be a benefit. Like out in the
sticks, if you can't accommodate the people, they go somewhere
else.
MR. RICHARDSON: Does anyone have any questions?
MR. DUNBAR: I will ask Mr. DePorter the same
question I asked Mr. Ivy. Do you have an estimate of the
total number of residents in this proposed area, or
designated area?
A. Heads?
MR. DUNBAR: Yes.
A. About 110 or 15, I think it is.
MR. DUNBAR: Thank you.
MR. RICHARDSON: The Commission and Mr. Telep:
I would like to advise the Commission that the other witnesses
I have here today, the three ladies would testify substantially
to the same things that the gentlemen have testified to, and to
save the Commission's time, I would like to be permitted to
have these ladies give their name and to have the Commission
consider the fact that their testimony would be the same;
that there is a need in the area for a 3.2 beer outlet.
MR. TELEP: Why don't you have them come up to the
reporter, give their name and address, and they would be the
ones who would testify, if given the opportunity, to
substantially what has already been testified to; is that
correct?
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MR. RICHARDSON: Yes.
MRS. WIGFIELD: Margaret Wigfield, Carr, Colorado.
MRS. DIEHL: Thelma Diehl, Carr, Colorado.
MRS. IVY: Fanny Ivy, Carr, Colorado.
MR. RICHARDSON: I have just one other item of
evidence that I would like to present through one question
that I would ask Mr. Wardman, if I may have the permission
to recall him.
FLOYD V. WARDMAN,
recalled as a witness by and on behalf of the Petitioner,
having been previously duly sworn, was examined and testified
further as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. RICHARDSON:
Q. You have already been sworn, so you may sit down
and I remind you that you have been sworn. Going to this
question of how many people are in the area as defined by
the County Commissioners, how many would you estimate are
living in this area?
A. I would say between 110 and 115. More than that,
much of our business comes off of the highway. We are not just
confined to this immediate area. It isn't like sitting out
on a side road in the sandhills.
Q. You have been acquainted with the business your
wife has had there for eight years. Would you be telling the
Commission that much of your business will also come from
transients?
A. Yes.
Q.
There will be some from the neighborhood, but a great
deal of it will be transient business.
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A. Yes, sir. The Cattle Association comes up there
when they have their roundup. Most of those gentlemen want
a few bottles of beer. A lot of times it is a pretty hot job.
Isn't this the reason you encouraged your wife to
Q.
apply for this license, is the request from the ranchers
and from the cattlemen in the area?
A. That is correct.
MR. RICHARDSON: Thank you, sir.
This is all of the testimony we have this afternoon
in support of our application for the carry -out 3.2 beer
license. We rest at this time.
MR. TELEP: Thank you, Mr. Richardson. When we
began this hearing, I announced that anyone in this hearing
room would be afforded the opportunity to testify against
the granting of this license if they so wished. Again, I
ask: Is there anyone in this hearing room who is here to
testify against the granting of this license? Hearing no
voice or no show of hands, I would like the record to show
there is no one in this hearing room opposed to the granting
of this 3.2 license to Mrs. Wardman.
MR. RICHARDSON: At this time normally we have
closing statement and the opposition follows. I don't think
there is much question there is no opposition here whatsoever.
There is no petition of any kind against this license, and
therefore I feel that without a doubt this license should be
granted. You have nothing before you but testimony in favor
of it and not one single item of testimony against it. So I
feel without question the license should be granted. Thank
you.
MR. MARSHALL ANDERSON: I move we take it under
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advisement and notify the applicant within 30 days.
MR. DUNBAR: Second the motion.
THE CHAIRMAN: It has been regularly moved and
seconded that this request be taken under advisement and you
will be notified within 30 days. If there is nothing further
to come before this meeting, we will call it adjourned.
STATE OF COLORADO)
ss.
COUNTY OF WELD )
REPORTER'S CERTIFICATE
I, Henrietta E. Brenner, Certified Shorthand Reporter,
State of Colorado, hereby certify that I took in shorthand all
the proceedings had and done in the foregoing hearing on the
3rd day of July, 1968. I further certify that the foregoing
20 pages contain a full, accurate and complete transcript
of my notes.
Dated this 23rd day of
July, 1968.
Greeley, Colorado
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