HomeMy WebLinkAbout871784.tiff 1
2
3 DOCKET INTO. 87-68L PHASE I
4
5 HEARING BEFORE THE WELD COUNTY COMMISSIONERS,
STATE OF COLORADO, TO CONSIDER THE LIQUOR LICENSE
6 RENEWAL FOR JUNE FAUDOA, D/B/A LA GARRA, 430 WALL STREET,
EATON, COLORADO, ON OCTOBER 19, 1987 AT THE HOUR OF
7 9: 00 A.M.
8 _.
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1C WELD COUNTY COMMISSIONERS : Gordon Lacy, Chairman
Gene Brantner
11 Jackie Johnson
Bill Kirby
12 Frank Yamaguchi
13 APPEARANCES :
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14 For the County Commissioners : Bruce Barker
15 For Weld County Sheriff 's Office : Bob Knepel
16 For June Faudoa : Keith McIntyre
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18
19
20
21
22
MABEI.L BROYLES
23 Certified Shorthand Reporter
Route 1, Box 48
24 Commerce City, Colorado 80022
7 659-1130
25
0717a4 -
I CHAIRMAN LACY: Thank you. Monday, October 19,
2 1987. We are now in session for liquor license renewal
3 hearing for June Faudoa. At this time, Mr. Barker, I think
4 we will go through the procedures of the hearing in a very
5 short form. The hearing will take the form that the
6 Sheriff ' s Office will present their evidence, the witnesses
7 and information that they may have. The Applicant for the
8 renewal or counselor will be able to cross-examine. We will
9 be cross-examining witnesses on both sides. This will. be
10 part of the procedure this morning as we go through the
11 process. After the Applicant has presented their
12 information, the counselor for the Sheriff ' s Department will
' 13 be allowed rebuttal. At that time then testimony or
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14 information will be closed as far as the hearing i:3
15 concerned. Bruce T. Barker is the attorney.
16 We will go through that procedure, is this
17 agreeable with --
18 MR. MCINTYRE: Yes. Is that Phase I of the
19 hearing or Phase II or both?
20 CHAIRMAN LACY: This will -- first we will go
21 through Phase I and that will be to determine if good cause
22 exists to refuse the renewal of the liquor license. Then we
23 got to Phase II .
24 MR. MCINTYRE : Is the evidence reopened on Phase
I 1
25 II where additional evidence can be presented or should we
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1 attempt to present that at the time or in other words present
2 the evidence all at once and then argue Phase I and Phase II?
3 MR. BARKER: I think probably Phase II has some
4 different issues talking about aggravating and mitigating
5 points; and so, it ' s up to you as to how you would wish to
6 present the evidence. I think the Commissioners can take
7 into consideration the evidence, you know, which is put into
8 evidence in Phase I. In Phase II, they sort of have to build
9 on what has been presented in Phase I with whatever you would
10 like to present in Phase II as to those mitigating and
11 aggravating circumstances.
12 MR. MCINTYRE: That ' s all I wanted to make sure.
13 I will have the opportunity in Phase II to present additional
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14 evidence, if I choose?
15 CHAIRMAN LACY : Yes.
16 MR. MCINTYRE : Okay. Thank you.
17 MR. BARKER: Mr. Chairman, I want to make --
18 CHAIRMAN LACY: Excuse me, Bruce, I forgot roll
19 call. We need to do roll call this morning.
20 CLERK : Gene Brantner.
21 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: Here.
22 CLERIC : Jackie Johnson.
23 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Here.
24 CLERK : Bill Kirby.
25 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: Here.
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1 CLERK : Frank Yamaguchi.
2 COMMISSIONER YAMAGUCHI : Here.
3 CLERK : Gordon Lacy.
4 CHAIRMAN LACY: Here.
5 MR. BARKER: I want to make a record of the
6 hearing. This is docket number 87-68L, Liquor License
7 Renewal Hearing for June Faudoa, d/b/a La Garra, 430 Wall
8 Street, Eaton, Colorado. This is, of course, to Weld County
9 Ordinance No. 102—A. There is no notice requirement as set
10 forth to be published. However, the Applicant does have to
11 post a notice at the location and I assume that that was done
12 and it has to be done ten days before the hearing itself.
13 MR. MCINTYRE : I believe it was posted the day
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14 after .
15 CHAIRMAN LACY: Would you come to the microphone
16 and introduce yourself?
17 MR. MCINTYRE : Keith McIntyre, attorney on behalf
18 of the Applicant. According to the Applicant , the notice was
19 posted the day after the last hearing, which would put it
20 more than ten days in advance of this hearing or at least ten
21 days.
22 MR. BARKER: As you had noted, there are two
23 phases of the hearing that is before us today. And that
24 again is in accordance with Weld County Ordinance 102-A. I
25 might just set forth the facts that you will be looking for
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1 today; and specifically, I would say that you should take
2 into consideration the two factors for which there was
3 evidence presented at the probable cause hearing and those
4 are set forth in the resolution for today' s hearing. The two
5 factors would be that there is evidence of violations in the
6 last one-year period by Ms. Faudoa, or by any of her agents,
7 servants, or employees of the provisions of the Colorado
8 Liquor Code and/or Ordinance 102-A and the rules and
9 regulations authorized pursuant to them. Secondly, that
10 there is evidence showing that excessive noise, or rowdiness,
11 or disburbances exist on a continuous basis in the immediate
12 area of the licensed premises, which has been substantially
13 as a result of the operation of the licensed premises.
14 So those are the two factors that you are taking
15 into consideration today. And that, of course, is Phase I of
16 the hearing. I have presented that in those two factors in
17 the hearing sheet , which I have given to each one of you. I
18 might also ask both attorneys and the Court Reporter how we
19 would like to set up the situation here today, as far as
20 getting the witnesses and the best location for them to be
21 asking the questions of each witness. I would leave it up to
22 you, and also, to i-Tr . Chairman as to how you would like to
23 set up.
24 CHAIRMAN LACY: Use the microphone, please.
25 MR. MCINTYRE : From my standpoint , since I will be
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1 taking notes and it ' s difficult to do on your lap, I would
2 appreciate if the counselors could sit at the table. I
3 assume Bob is in somewhat the same boat. I would suggest
4 perhaps that we put an additional chair over here somewhere
5 for a witness, if there is any, or perhaps even up on the
6 corner there where there is a microphone. And then use this
7 to interrogate the witness from.
8 MR. KNEPEL : Bob Kneppel. K-n-e-p-p-e-1. That
9 sounds fine with me, if the Board sees fit to do that.
10 CHAIRMAN LACY: Okay. This is agreeable with the
11 Board.
12 MR. BARKER: I would prefer not to have a witness
13 up here.
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14 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I think it would be
15 difficult with Bill being down here.
16 CHAIRMAN LACY: I think we can move the microphone
17 from the stand. We can put this down here and use it as far
18 as the witness is concerned on this even. I think we can use
19 that third microphone right here.
20 MR. KNEPEL : It might work as well if we lawyers
21 use this microphone and we simply move that to the end of the
22 table and have the witness seated there. That ' s my
23 understanding. That ' s what we would do. The two attorneys
24 will be sitting at the table in front of us, is that correct?
•
25 MR. MCINTYRE: Right.
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1 CHAIRMAN LACY : And then the witness can use the
2 stand microphone at the end of the table.
3 MR. MCINTYRE : Well, we were going to interrogate
4 or ask questions from up here, but I think the two attorneys
5 at the table can use one microphone between us and then turn
6 the other one to the end and put the chair on the end.
7 CHAIRMAN LACY: Okay. I misunderstood.
8 MR. BARKER: Is that going to be all right with
9 you Mabel?
10 REPORTER: That ' s fine.
11 CHAIRMAN LACY : At this time then, Mr. Barker, I
12 think we are ready to proceed with Phase I, is that correct?
13 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct . As far as the order
14 again, it goes with Mr. Knepel and then with Mr . McIntyre.
15 As far as opening statements, you could either have both
16 opening statements at the start and then get into the
17 evidence or have, if Keith would like to wait and have his
18 opening statement after Mr. Kneppel has offered his
19 testimony. I think usually it ' s correct to have both opening
20 statements right at the start and then get into the testimony
21 after that .
22 CHAIRMAN LACY: I believe that would be fair .
23 Okay, we will have Mr. Knappel ' s opening statement and then
24 we will have yours, Mr . McIntyre, and then we will get into
25 the evidence.
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1 MR. MCINTYRE : Thank you.
2 MR. KNEPEL : Good morning. Our position is that
3 the liquor license sought to be renewed should be denied.
4 The Commissioners should refuse to renew that license. In
5 support of that this morning, I will put on witnesses to
6 document with some specifics four particular incidents that I
7 think will demonstrate to you why refusal to renew is
8 appropriate in the circumstances of this business.
9 Finally, in addition, I will be putting on
10 Lieutenant McGuirk, who will have some more generalized
11 information about the frequency and sort of calls as to which
12 the Sheriff ' s Office constantly has to be sending people out
13 to this location to deal with the problems that arise there.
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14 I believe when you have heard the evidence, we will have
15 demonstrated by a preponderance of that evidence that this
16 license should not be renewed.
17 Thank you.
18 MR. MCINTYRE : Thank you. Keith McIntyre on
19 behalf of the Applicant. Very briefly, we feel that while
20 the evidence may show one or two technical violations under
21 Count 1 under Section 1, we don 't feel that the evidence will
22 show that the second ground exists. We further feel that
23 mitigating circumstances will be presented such that the
24 Board should renew the license. Or at the very most, renew
25 it with a relatively short suspension. But we feel that the
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1 license in this case should be renewed. We think the
2 evidence will show that .
3 Thank you.
4 MR. KNEPEL : I would now call Deputy Mark Johnson.
5 CHAIRMAN LACY : We will have the Court Reporter
6 swear in the witnesses.
7 HARK JOHNSON,
8 a witness herein, having been first duly sworn to state
9 the whole truth, testified on his oath as follows :
10 EXAMINATION
11 BY MR. KNEPEL :
12 Q Would you state your full name?
13 CHAIRMAN LACY: Bob, excuse me, would you state
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14 your name for the record as long as we are starting .
15 MR. KNEPEL : Yes. My name again is Bob Knepel,
16 spelled K-n-e-p-e-1.
17 Would you state your name, Deputy, for the record?
18 A My name is Mark Johnson.
19 Q And how are you employed?
20 A I am a Sergeant with Weld County Sheriff ' s Office.
21 Q Were you so employed on December 13th, 1986?
22 A I was.
23 Q Did you have occasion on that date to investigate
24 an incident at a bar in Eaton?
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25 A Yes, I did.
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1 Q What was the location of that bar?
2 A The La Garra bar . I don 't recall the exact
3 address. It was the 400 block of Wall Street.
4 Q What was the nature of the incident that you had
5 to investigate?
6 A Now, previous to my involvement , there had been a
7 disturbance at the bar and involved a disorderly conduct and
8 a criminal mischief. There were two suspects, one of them
9 came into the Sheriff ' s Office a day or so later and I
10 obtained a statement from him in regards to the disorderly
11 conduct . And during that statement came to light that he was
12 19 years old and had been at the bar drinking prior to the
r 13 disturbance.
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14 Q I see. Could you name specifically the person
15 whom you are describing, this 19 year old?
16 A Tracy -- could I see a copy of the report, please?
17 Q Yes, you may. First, I should ask you to identify
18 what that document is that I have just handed you?
19 A This is a case report that I wrote on the
20 incident.
21 Q Could you review that report, please, to find the
22 suspect ' s name that you talked to after the incident?
23 A I spoke with a Leon MaDrono and a Rita MaDrono.
24 Leon was the suspect in the disorderly conduct . He spoke no
25 English, only Spanish and Rita was a sister-in-law and she
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1 interpreted for me.
- 2 Q Now, how old is or how old was Leon MaDrono at the
3 time of this incident?
4 A He was 19.
5 0 And at the time you talked to him, had you
6 informed him specifically that he was a suspect in some sort
7 of a criminal incident?
8 A Yes.
9 Q What offense was it that you suspected him of?
10 A Disorderly conduct and criminal mischief.
11 Q And in connection with your interview of Leon
12 MaDrono, did you advise him of his constitutional rights per
I I 13 Miranda?
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14 A Yes, I did.
15 Q Did he agree to talk to you after that advisement?
16 A Yes, he did.
17 Q What did he tell you specifically about the
18 incident?
19 A Well, through the interpreter, he advised that he
20 had gone into the bar with his brother and co-worker and a
21 co-worker had gone up to the bar, got beers for all of them,
22 come back to the table and handed them out to everybody.
23 Q Did Leon MaDrono indicate that any bar employee
24 had ever asked to see identification from him?
25 A No one asked for any identification.
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1 MR. KNEPEL : That ' s all I have from this witness.
2 EXAMINATION
3 BY MR. MCINTYRE :
4 Q Sergeant Johnson, if I understand your testimony
5 correctly, the co-worker acquired the beer from the bar and
6 then gave it to Leon MaDrono, is that correct?
7 A Correct.
8 Q No bar employee served Leon directly the beer?
9 A Correct.
10 Q All right. You indicated that you had responded
11 and were talking to him in connection with an incident of
12 criminal mischief and disorderly conduct, who called that
r ! 13 incident there?
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14 A I --
15 Q Let me rephrase the question, perhaps make it
16 easier. Wasn 't it called in by an employee of the bar?
17 A I don 't have a copy of that case. The case I
18 worked on was related to the criminal mischief case, so mine
19 was -- I don 't know exactly who called in the initial
20 criminal mischief disorderly conduct report.
21 Q Was it your understanding it was an employee of
22 the bar?
23 A I don ' t know.
24 Q Who was the alleged victim of the criminal
25 mischief?
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1 A I don't recall.
2 Q Was it the bar?
3 A I believe it was some trouble outside the bar.
4 Q In connection with this incident, did you speak
5 with the La Garra owners?
6 A Yes, I did.
7 Q And ask for a statement from them?
8 A Yes, I did.
9 MR. MCINTYRE : I have nothing further .
10 MR. KNEPEL : I have nothing further from this
11 witness. You may be excused.
12 I would next call Deputy John Cooke.
f ! 13 JOHN COOKE,
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14 a witness herein, having been first duly sworn to state
15 the whole truth, testified on his oath as follows :
16 EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. KNEPEL :
18 MR. KNEPEL : Before we proceed with this next
19 incident, I guess I should ask one question. Deputy Johnson
20 apparently has worked a very late shift and wonders whether
21 he is needed for any later phase of this? I don ' t anticipate
22 calling him and if it ' s all right with the Board and
23 counselor, I would excuse him at this time.
24 MR. MCINTYRE : We have no objection.
25 CHAIRMAN LACY : Board? Board has no objection.
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1 He may be excused.
_ 2 MR. JOHNSON: Thank you.
3 Q (By Mr. Knepel) Would you state your name and
4 occupation for the record?
5 A John Cook, C-o-o-k-e. I am an investigator with
6 the Sheriff ' s Office.
7 Q Were you involved with the investigation of an
8 incident at the La Garra bar which occurred on March 14th of
9 1987?
10 A Yes, I was.
11 Q Could you describe briefly the nature of the
12 incident that occurred there on that date?
r 13 A It was a homicide where a man was sitting at the
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14 bar. A man was sitting at the bar. Another man walked up to
15 him, tapped him on the shoulder and when he turned around,
16 the man that was sitting at the bar got shot in the head.
17 The man that did the shooting then backed up and was waving
18 the gun at other people inside the bar and some other people
19 grabbed him and the gun went off and hit a second person
20 sitting in a booth.
21 Q Now, you were connected with the investigation of
22 this incident, is that correct?
23 A That ' s correct.
24 Q Did you see Sheriff ' s Office reports in connection
25 with the incident?
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1 A Yes.
2 Q Do you know whether blood alcohol was taken of the
3 defendants in the homicide case?
4 A Yes, I do.
5 Q Now, could you identify him by name, please?
6 A Rosales Santos.
7 Q Do you recall what his blood alcohol content was
8 when that alcohol test was taken?
9 A It was point 168.
10 Q Did you yourself interview any witnesses in
11 connection with the incident?
12 A Yes, I did.
13 Q Who did you talk to?
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14 A Talked to about 29, 30 people in total .
15 Q Let me narrow it down: Do you recall talking to
16 someone named Robert Vialpando?
17 A Yes, I do.
18 Q How old was Hr. Vialpando at the time of this
19 incident on March 14?
20 A Nineteen.
21 Q What did Mr . Vialpando indicate as to his
22 knowledge of the circumstances surrounding this?
23 A He advised that he didn ' t really see much of the
24 shooting and he heard a shot and that was about it .
25 Q Where was he at the time that he heard the shot?
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1 A He was inside the bar .
2 Q He was inside the bar?
3 A Yes.
4 Q And did he indicate to you whether or not he had
5 been drinking at or around the time of this incident?
6 A Yes, he did.
7 Q Did he indicate what he had been drinking?
8 A A beer.
9 Q Did he say who served that to him?
10 A Said one of the ladies in the bar.
11 MR. KNEPEL : Nothing further from this witness.
12 MR. MCINTYRE : Do you desire us to identify
f-1 13 ourselves each time we come up?
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14 CHAIRMAN LACY : No.
15 MR. MCINTYRE : Okay, thank you.
16 EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. MCINTYRE :
18 Q Deputy Cooke, in the course of your investigation,
19 did you -- were you able to determine how long Rosales Santos
20 had been in the bar before the shooting?
21 A We believe several hours is what -- we don 't know
22 an exact amount of time.
23 Q Do you know whether he had been drinking anywhere
24 else besides at the bar?
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25 A Yes.
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1 Q [lad he been?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Where else?
4 A The Eaton Pool Hall .
5 Q Do you know how long he had been there?
6 A A few hours. Quite a few hours, I believe.
7 Q Okay. Were you able to determine what he had had
8 to drink in this bar , if anything?
9 A No, not how many beers.
10 Q Did Roberto Vialpando indicate to you whether he
11 was accompanied by his mother when he walked into the bar?
12 A I believe he did. I would have to reread my
13 report, but I am thinking he did indicate that .
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14 Q Was this on the same day of the shooting or was
15 this on a different day?
16 A That he went into the bar?
17 Q Yes.
18 A It was the same day of the shooting.
19 MR. MCINTYRE : I have nothing further.
20 CHAIRMAN LACY: Does the Board have any questions?
21 I do at this time. I did not -- maybe I missed it
22 in the testimony, that the suspect was observed drinking in
23 the bar before the shooting, is that correct?
24 A Yes. He was seen also dancing on the dance floor
25 and put by some witnesses as like a clown dancing with his
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1 beer bottle.
2 CHAIRMAN LACY : Further questions?
3 MR. KNEPEL : None for this witness.
4 CHAIRMAN LACY : Okay.
5 MR. BARKER: Mr. Chairman, on other witnesses, I
6 must just suggest that if you would like to go through and
7 make sure that the attorneys have asked all of their
8 questions and if you have any questions, then go ahead and
9 ask those. If the attorneys would have any other follow up
10 questions after the questions that you have asked them would
11 be fine too.
12 CHAIRMAN LACY : Yes. That ' s permissible.
13 MR. KNEPEL : At this time I would call Maria Loma
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14 Garcia.
15 MARIA LOMA GARCIA,
16 a witness herein, having been first duly sworn to state
17 the whole truth, testified on her oath as follows :
18 EXAMINATION
19 BY MR. KNEPEL :
20 Q Would you state your name for the record.
21 A Maria Loma Garcia.
22 Q And did you become involved in some type of a
23 Sheriff ' s Office investigation, which occurred on May 22nd,
24 1987?
25 A Yes.
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1 Q How did you happen to become involved in that?
. 2 A I am an Explorer for the Sheriff ' s Office and they
3 come and they said that if I would go with Sergeant Brave to
4 a bar to see if they would sell me beer or alcohol, whatever.
5 Q And did you agree to do that?
6 A Yes.
7 Q Do you remember going to a bar in east Eaton?
8 A Yes. It was -- I think 430 Wall Street. La Garra
9 or something like that.
10 Q And what exactly, you know, could you describe
11 your role in this incident? What did you do in connection
12 with this?
13 CHAIRMAN LACY: Would you speak up a little
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14 louder, please, or a little closer to the microphone?
15 A Me and Sergeant Brave went in a car, police car,
16 but I don't know how you call it. We got there about 11: 30
17 and I was supposed to go in with -- they gave me money and
18 they was -- they had the serial number and everything. I was
19 supposed to go in and order -- ask for a beverage drink and I
20 was supposed to give them one of the bills and I did.
21 Q I see. So when you went in the bar , what -- well,
22 first off, where did you go inside the bar?
23 A I don 't understand the question.
24 Q Well, as you walk in the bar door, I assume this
25 is a big place, did you go right up to the bar or did you
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1 take a seat at a table? Where did you go?
2 A I went straight to the bar.
3 Q Did you talk to anyone there?
4 A No, there wasn ' t a lot of people talking. There
5 was some guys drinking, but they were beside the bar, you
6 know. There was nobody sitting by the bar except Sergeant
7 Brave.
8 Q Did you in fact order a drink?
9 A Yes, I ordered a margarita.
10 Q I+Iargarita?
11 A Yes.
12 Q From whom did you order that?
13 A Francisco Gallegos was the bartender.
14 Q And did he in fact serve you a margarita?
15 A Yes, he did.
16 Q Did you pay for that margarita?
17 A Yes. When he handed -- when he put the margarita
18 in front of me, I handed him the 5 dollar bill and he went to
19 the cash register and I left.
20 Q So you paid for this drink yourself?
21 A Yes.
22 Q And this 5 dollar bill that you used, had that
23 been marked?
24 A Yes, it was marked.
25 Q I see. Was there anyone from the Sheriff ' s Office
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1 in the bar with you at this time?
_ 2 A Yes, Sergeant Brave.
3 Q How close was he standing to you when you ordered
4 your drink?
5 A He was about two stools from me.
6 Q Two stools from you?
7 A Two stools from the bar .
8 Q And did he order your drink for you?
9 A No.
10 Q Or offer to pay for it himself?
11 A He went in first . He was supposed to go in first
12 so that we wouldn ' t be together so when I went inside he was
13 already sitting there, but he didn' t get or I told him
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14 myself.
15 Q And when you paid for your drink, did you have any
16 change coming back?
17 A Yes.
18 Q Were you given that change?
19 A No, because I left right away. As soon as I gave
20 him the money, I left.
21 Q So then you left immediately after getting the
22 drink?
23 A After paying.
24 Q After paying?
25 A Yes.
F371.4SE
1 MR. KNEPEL : Nothing further from this witness.
2 If I might, just to correct a little something.
3 MR. MCINTYRE : I think I know what you want to
4 correct.
5 MR. KNEPEL : Sure. Miss Loma Garcia, how old
6 were you at the time that this incident occurred?
7 A It was on my birthday. I was 20 .
8 Q Twenty?
9 A I had just turned 20 that day.
10 MR. KNEPEL : I see. Thank you.
11 MR. BARKER: I just asked the Court Reporter ,
12 Deputy -- it was Brave, is that correct?
13 A Yes.
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14 MR. BARKER: Do you have the spelling of that just
15 in case. I believe it 's spelled B-r-a-v-e.
16 EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. MCINTYRE :
18 Q Is it Loma Garcia, is that what you go by?
19 A Yes.
20 Q Miss Loma Garcia, was this the only bar that you
21 went to that day?
22 A No. We went to another bar over there by Hudson.
23 I don't remember the name. We were supposed to go to two
24 bars, but when we went over there, they didn ' t sell me beer .
25 Q There were two only that you went to, right?
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1 A Yes.
2 Q Now, I am a little confused. You ordered the
3 drink from the bartender?
4 A Yes.
5 Q When did you give him the money?
6 A When he put the margarita in front of me.
7 Q When he put it in front of you, you handed him the
8 money?
9 A Yes.
10 Q Did he turn away before you got up and left or did
11 you get up and leave right away?
12 A What do you mean? I don 't understand.
l 1 13 Q Did the bartender turn away to walk to the cash
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14 register before you got up and walked out of the premises?
15 A Yes, he was walking to the cash register when I
16 walked out.
17 Q You did not consume any of the drink?
18 A No.
19 Q Or touch did?
20 A No.
21 MR. MCINTYRE : Nothing further .
22 CHAIRMAN LACY: Does the Board have any questions?
23 Thank you.
24 MR. KNEPEL : Nothing further from this witness.
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25 In connection with the same incident, I would now call Deputy
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1 Brave.
,_ L 2 STEVE BRAVE,
3 a witness herein, having been first duly sworn to state
4 the whole truth, testified on his oath as follows :
5 EXAMINATION
6 BY MR. KNEPEL :
7 Q Would you state your name and your occupation for
8 the record?
9 A Steve Brave, Corrections Officer and Reserve
10 Deputy of Weld County Sheriff ' s Office.
11 Q Did you play a role in connection with the
12 Sheriff ' s Office investigation on May 22nd, 1987 that ' s
-1 13 relevant to this hearing today?
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14 A Yes.
15 Q What specifically was your role in that
16 investigation?
17 A Key part was to play a witness in observing Maria
18 Loma Garcia in purchasing a mixed drink.
19 Q Did you in fact observe her purchase such a drink?
20 A Yes, I did.
21 Q Where?
22 A At the La Garra bar in Eaton, 430 Main.
23 Q Do you know how she paid for that drink?
24 A With a 5 dollar bill .
25 Q Was that 5 dollar bill marked so as to be
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1 identifiable or unique somehow?
2 A Yes, it was.
3 Q Do you know whether that 5 dollar bill was
4 recovered after she bought her drink?
5 A Yes, it was.
6 Q From whom or from where was it recovered?
7 A From Deputy Ken Poncell .
8 Q Do you know who he recovered it from or from
9 where?
10 A The bartender, Francisco Gallegos.
11 Q At the time that Miss Loma Garcia ordered this
12 margarita in the bar, where were you when she did that?
13 A Sitting just two bar stools from her left.
L
14 Q Did you talk with her or gesture as to indicate
15 you knew her in some faction?
16 A No, sir.
17 Q Did you indicate in any way that you were ordering
18 the drink for her?
19 A No, sir. I did not.
20 Q Did she order the drink herself?
21 A Yes, she did.
22 Q Did you move as though to pay for the drink?
23 A No, sir.
24 MR. KNEPEL : Nothing further from this witness.
25 MR. MCINTYRE : No questions.
871488
1 CHAIRMAN LACY: I have a question.
2 COMMISIONER BRANTNER: Maybe he could answer that
3 for us.
4 CHAIRMAN LACY: Were you at the bar at the time
5 this drink was purchased?
6 A Yes, I was.
7 CHAIRMAN LACY: Okay. The question that I have is
8 did anyone ask for the young lady' s i. d. at the bar?
9 A No, sir.
10 CHAIRMAN LACY: Thank you.
11 A They did not.
12 CHAIRMAN LACY : Are there any further questions
P ! 13 from the Board? You may be excused.
i
14 MR. KNEPEL : I would now call Deputy Toft.
15 RICHARD TOFT,
16 a witness herein, having been first duly sworn to state
17 the whole truth, testified on his oath as follows :
18 EXAMINATION
19 BY MR. KNEPEL :
20 Q Would you state your name for the record and spell
21 it for the reporter?
22 A My name is Richard Toft, T-o-f-t. I am a Deputy
23 Sherriff of Weld County Sheriff ' s Office.
24 Q Did you have occasion to investigate an incident
25 at the La Garra bar on September 27th, 1987?
87
1 A Yes, I did. I was called to that location in
2 reference to a fight with possible weapons outside that bar.
3 Q When you arrived at the bar, did you contact any
4 witnesses to that incident?
5 A Yes, I did. I contacted my victim. She wished --
6 well, at the time I contacted her, she advised that she had
7 had a fight with her husband and that he had pulled a knife
8 on her and then had left the scene when we arrived there.
9 Q I see. So this incident really had its beginning
10 where?
11 A My victim advised me as far as a verbal argument
12 started inside the bar.
13 Q Had the suspect been drinking to your knowledge
i
14 according to what the witness told you?
15 A Yes, both of them had.
16 Q Both of them had?
17 A Both of them had been drinking. My victim and my
18 suspect.
19 Q Do you know where they had been doing that
20 drinking?
21 A At the La Garra bar.
22 Q Did you in fact contact the suspect in connection
23 with this incident?
24 A Yes, I did. I contacted him around the side of a
25 house, which he was hiding from us and at that time I pulled
871488
1 him out over towards our patrol cars and begun a search on
2 him, since he supposedly had a Chinese Star with him and/or a
3 knife. At that time, as I searched him, his pockets, he
4 turned -- excuse me, turned around, took a swing at this
5 officer, at me, at which time I placed him under arrest.
6 Q Did he present you with any further difficulties
7 in the course of his arrest?
8 A Yes, he did. At that time, my Sergeant, Sergeant
9 Tom Johnson had pulled up with his police cruiser and I put
10 him in the back seat of the police cruiser and he had kicked
11 the sirens on when we had gone back for numerous other fights
12 there. I had seen approximately three other fights going on
13 at that time. The suspect kicked the sirens on. Sergeant
L
14 Johnson then returned to his car where the suspect kicked
15 him, I believe the right side of the face.
16 Q With what you have said so far, does that pretty
17 much describe the real incident that caused you to go to this
18 location in the first place?
19 A Yes, it is.
20 Q At the location, did you have occasion to
21 investigate the area, search for evidence or weapons or clues
22 of any sort?
23 A Yes, we had. At the time I was pulling up, two
24 other parties in my patrol unit, Sergeant Tom Johnson was
25 then looking for the knife that our suspect had had at that
871488
1 location. And he had found this crobar hanging in the trees
2 in a tree approximately about ten yards behind me where I had
3 a wrestling match with that suspect.
4 Q I see. Now, where was that crobar found then in
5 relation to the bar?
6 A Right across the street from it.
7 Q It was actually found in a tree?
8 A Yes. The hook, I believe it was hooked just in
9 the V of the branches -- in the branches in a tree.
10 Q Now, I notice -- obviously, you or someone ceased
11 that bar as evidence, is that correct?
12 A Yes, sir.
13 Q Why?
14 A Mainly because of the, I guess, a person whoever
15 put it there, knew that it was going to be there. In
16 relation to what, I don' t know. In the future, if it was
17 possibly going to be a fight that it was accessible, I do not
18 know.
19 Q So your fear was that it might be used as a
20 weapon?
21 A Yes, sir.
22 Q But it was not ceased as evidence specifically in
23 connection with this assault?
24 A No, sir. No one made mention of a crobar.
I
25 Q Now, when you were on the scene, did you also have
871'188
1 occasion to discuss a prior incident with a confidential
2 informant?
3 A Yes, I did. After this happening in the past, I
4 had the opportunity to talk with confidential informant who
5 advised me --
6 Q First, let ' s clarify, what incident was the
7 confidential informant talking about?
8 A The murder that happened in La Garra bar or the
9 homicide, excuse me.
10 Q Is that the homicide wherein the defendant was Mr.
11 Santos?
12 A Yes, it was.
13 Q Rosales Santos?
J
14 A Yes, it was.
15 Q And that occurred in March of ' 87?
16 A Yes.
17 Q At the bar?
18 A Yes.
19 Q What did your confidential informant tell you that
20 was relevant to that earlier homicide incident?
21 A That his name is Anthony Rosales. I believe he is
22 either a bartender there or security. That he had moved the
23 murder weapon into the men ' s bathroom, which is where our
24 deputies later found it. I believe two or three days later
25 we found the weapon in the bathroom.
871488
1 Q When you say two or three days later, you mean two
2 or three days after being told this or two or three days
3 after the original incident?
4 A After the original incident.
5 Q So the the confidential informant then essentially
6 provided you with an explanation of why that weapon was found
7 there?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And that informant told you who had put it there?
10 A She had stated she had heard that Anthony Rosales
11 had moved the weapon.
12 Q Did your confidential informant tell you anything
F-H 13 further about Tony Rosales?
L
14 A Yes. Also, she had stated that he had been
15 getting on to the stage of the bar, which would have been
16 this place and getting on the microphone and advising the bar
17 patrons that do not let the police harass you. You got
18 rights. If they do stop you, make them perform their job and
19 don' t let them, excuse me, don't let them arrest you without
20 a fight.
21 Q Are you aware of any relationship between Tony
22 Rosales and the present licensee in connection with this bar?
23 A I do not know.
24 Q Nothing beyond employee so far as you know?
25 A Yes.
271_49R
1 MR. KNEPEL : Nothing further.
2 EXAMINATION
3 BY MR. MCINTYRE :
4 Q Deputy Toft, this last incident you say that your
5 confidential informant told you concerning the one Antonio
6 Rosales getting on the microphone?
7 A Yes, sir.
8 Q Can you tell when that supposedly occurred?
9 A When he supposedly said that?
10 Q Yes.
11 A She said it was the same night that we had the
12 fight up there, myself and Tom Johnson had gone into the bar
13 and this was approximately four or five minutes before
14 that incident happened. Myself and Tom Johnson and I don't
15 know if it was Mr . Rosales on the microphone, but I did hear
16 police and then the patrons clapping four or five minutes
17 before the actual fight had happened.
18 Q So you had been in the bar previously just on a
19 routine check?
20 A That ' s -- yes, sir.
21 Q Okay. Did you notice whether the victim and
22 suspect were in there at that time?
23 A No, I did not .
24 Q Okay. Now, as I understand it, with regard to the
T
25 claim that the bartender had moved the weapon to the men' s
871488
1 room, she stated she had heard from someone else that he had
2 put the gun in the bathroom?
3 A Yes, sir.
4 Q So it ' s double hearsay coming to you?
5 A Yes, sir.
6 Q Okay. The original fight that you were called
7 there to deal with was between a husband and wife, is that
8 correct?
9 A Yes, sir .
10 Q And it occurred across the street from the La
11 Garra bar?
12 A When I contacted them, that ' s where they were at.
r- 13 Q And you mentioned there were several other fights
L
14 rippling around at that time?
15 A Yes, sir.
16 Q That was across the street from the La Garra bar?
17 A Yes, sir.
18 Q What ' s the -- isn ' t the neighborhood up there
19 residential across the street from the La Garra bar?
20 A Yes, sir, it is.
21 Q And in fact, weren' t the other fights that were
22 involved all involving one particular family and extended
23 family?
24 A Yes, sir, it was.
25 Q And didn't the fight in fact occur in the front
871488
1 yard of an aunt of one of the members of that family?
2 A No, sir. From what I remember, it was in the
3 middle of the street.
4 Q Isn 't the house across the street one of the
5 members of that family?
6 A It could possibly be. I do not know.
7 Q Do you have any idea how long the victim and
8 suspect were in the bar?
9 A No, sir. My victim just advised me that they were
10 over there for the evening.
11 Q You don' t know how much they had to drink there?
12 A No, sir.
13 Q Do you know whether other similar fights have
L
14 occurred between the victim and the suspect?
15 A I do not know.
16 Q You haven 't checked the rap sheet on the suspect
17 to see if there were other complaints?
18 A No, sir.
19 MR. MCINTYRE : Nothing further of this witness.
20 CHAIRMAN LACY : Any questions from the Board at
21 this time?
22 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: For further clarification,
23 of the other numerous fights, you stated that they were all
24 across the street, were any in the vicinity of the bar
25 itself?
871489
1 A They were approximately in the middle of the
2 street.
3 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Okay.
4 CHAIRMAN LACY : Further questions? Thank you.
5 MR. KNEPEL : I would next call Lieutenant McGuirk .
6 STEVE MCGUIRK,
7 a witness herein, having been first duly sworn to state
8 the whole truth, testified on his oath as follows :
9 EXAMINATION
10 BY MR. KNEPEL :
11 Q Would you state your name and your occupation for
12 the record and spell your last name for the Court Reporter?
L I 13 A My name is Steve McGuirk, Cap M-c, Cap G as in
L
14 George, u-i-r-k. I am a Lieutenant with the Weld County
15 Sheriff ' s Office.
16 Q In connection with this hearing today, what have
17 you done in terms of preparing information for the Board?
18 A Each time that there is a liquor license renewal
19 in the County in our jurisdiction, I am notified by the Clerk
20 to the Board of the date and time of that renewal hearing and
21 it is my job to check our computer system, check our records
22 system, in this case, bar files and find out if there is any
23 activity over the past year of the licensee for that time and
24 if there is, I will look into it to see if any of it would
25 have any bearing on the liquor renewal positive or negative
ff14&3
1 nature.
2 Q I see. I am going to hand you a document of
3 actually quite a few pages here and I would ask whether you
4 can identify it and identify it?
5 A Yes, sir. This particular memorandum is a crime
6 analysis run that I requested. It is available to us through
7 our computer system. This particular case, the coordinants
8 are fed into the computer as to the particular location. We
9 call it a G.O. code, where we take a number on one side of
10 the County horizontal and another set of numbers that are
11 vertical where the two connect like in a map, the numbers on
12 a map. That square mile, the computer will bring up all the
13 the activity in that particular square mile and in this case
L.
14 the G.O. code I fed was the one that included the La Garra
15 bar of east Eaton would be in this square mile.
16 Q I see. Do you document how many reported calls to
17 that location?
18 A The computer run is showing twelve.
19 Q And those cover a time period of when to when?
20 A From October 1 of '86 to October 1 of ' 87 .
21 Q Now, I believe two of the calls shown on that top
22 sheet are incidents that have already been referred to this
23 morning, is that correct? Specifically, I direct your
24 attention to number 2 , which I believe we discussed, other
I 1
25 witnesses have discussed earlier this morning, is that right?
871488
1 A That is correct.
2 Q And then again to number 7?
3 A That is correct. That has already been discussed.
4 Q I see. You have sat here this morning and
5 listened to the other witnesses, is that correct?
6 A That ' s correct.
7 Q Did you hear anyone describe these other incidents
8 reflected on your cover sheet there?
9 A I believe number 3 was discussed by Sergeant Mark
10 Johnson.
11 Q Okay. Thank you.
12 A And I believe number 8 was discussed by Officer
F ! 13 Brave and Explorer Garcia.
L
14 Q Okay. Do you see any others that have been
15 discussed by other witnesses this morning?
16 A Not to my knowledge.
17 Q So essentially, what you have there, while it ' s
18 hearsay, is some documentation of approximately how many
19 additional calls to this location?
20 A This is documentation on the number of calls that
21 reports were written to that location.
22 Q It has a total of how many incidents listed on the
23 front sheet?
24 A Twelve.
25 Q Four have been discussed, so that would leave
8711188
1 essentially eight additional incidents that we have not
_ _ 2 discussed this morning, is that correct?
3 A Ones that were written. Reports were written on.
4 There are other ones that were no reports written on, because
5 people were not there when our officers arrived. Those are
6 not reflected.
7 MR. KNEPEL : I see. If I could have an exhibit
8 sticker, I would identify what he has got there.
9 MR. BARKER: Okay, we will call it Exhibit C.
10 MR. MCINTYRE : May I ask now while he is doing
11 that, what Exhibits A and B are?
12 MR. BARKER: Okay, Exhibits A and B had already
13 been submitted. I believe that Exhibit -- let ' s see, Exhibit
L J
14 A is a resolution setting the hearing. Exhibit B is the
15 notice of the hearing.
16 MR. MCINTYRE : Okay. I would request at this time
17 a recess in the hearing to allow me an opportunity to review
18 the material. I might add that at the last hearing I
19 requested and was furnished with the basis for what we
20 thought was the allegations made in this case. This was not
21 furnished to us and I have never seen it before this morning
22 and I didn 't know it existed, so I would request time to read
23 it over and review it before determining whether to object
24 and for purposes of cross-examination.
25 MR. KNEPEL : To respond, I would say certainly I
R7i481
1 am familiar that in criminal cases, there is a rule requiring
2 discovery by one side against another and I am not familiar
3 with any such rule here. Now, I don' t mean to be ambushing
4 the Applicant here and I am not asking the Board to put a
5 great deal of credence in this stuff. Obviously, it ' s
6 hearsay. But I do believe it documents to a reasonable
7 extent eight additional calls to which the Sheriff ' s Office
8 has had to report to this location. It ' s my understanding
9 that at a hearing of this sort, hearsay is admissible so
10 that ' s no obstacle. I can understand the Petitioner would
11 like a chance to explore each of these incidents. I am not
12 asking the Board to put a great deal of credence in the
r ! 13 factual circumstances reported, but simply to take note that
L
14 the Sheriff ' s Office has been called to this location on at
15 least eight other incidents. For that reason, I would submit
16 that in the interest of time and efficiency, we simply
17 proceed. I would move to admit Exhibit C.
18 MR. MCINTYRE : I would request, as I say, that I
19 be allowed to look at it after I have to make an objection to
20 it. I don' t know whether I have any --
21 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I think Mr. McIntyre is
22 right. It ' s material and I don ' t mind having a very short
23 recess. I don' t think it ' s necessary for us, as Mr. Knepel ,
24 has suggested to review each incident right today.
I
25 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: How long of a recess?
871;188
1 MR. MCINTYRE : Five to ten minutes at the most.
2 Just enough to skim through what ' s here.
3 CHAIRMAN LACY : I would like to -- it is according
4 to my watch 10 : 10, I would like to reconvene at 10 : 15.
5 MR. BARKER: Just for the record, I would also
6 like to mention that the documents that Keith had referred to
7 were the documents which Steve had given to us at the
8 probable cause hearing. Those are the ones I had copies made
9 of and I took them over to Keith shortly after that hearing.
10 MR. MCINTYRE : These were all in fairness
11 apparently prepared on 10-16, so it wasn 't something that
12 what has been around for a long time or could have been given
13 to me.
L
14 CHAIRMAN LACY: Okay, we will recess for five
15 minutes. Thank you.
16 (Short recess taken. )
17 CHAIRMAN LACY: The Hearing Board will reconvene.
18 MR. MCINTYRE : Mr. Chairman, as to Exhibit C, I
19 have had a chance to quickly skim through this, not to look
20 at it in any detail . Recognizing that hearsay is admissible
21 in an administrative hearing, for the record I will still
22 object on the basis that it ' s hearsay. And that much of the
23 items contained in here are not specifically related to the
24 La Garra bar.
25 MR. KNEPEL : Again, it ' s our position hearsay is
871488
1 admissible. Obviously, it ' s for the Board to give this as
2 much weight as it ' s worth. I would simply ask the Board to
3 take or to recognize the frequency with which the Sheriff ' s
4 officers are called to this location and that ' s the sole
5 point of its admission.
6 CHAIRMAN LACY: We will allow it as part of the
7 evidence.
8 MR. BARKER: Okay. I just might want to say that
9 the -- again, we are supposed to give hearsay or hearsay
10 statement appropriate weight and if it ' s something that you
11 would normally accept in your common business affairs as
12 something that you would act upon and that ' s something even
13 though it is hearsay you can take into evidence.
L
14 MR. BRANTNER: I would ask for clarification of
15 hearsay. Now, these are actual reports written of incidents
16 happening up there. What ' s the difference between an actual
17 report and hearsay?
18 MR. BARKER: Hearsay is what they call an out of
19 Court statement made for the truth of the matter asserted.
20 Basically, what it means is if you have a statement which is
21 made outside your presence here, okay, and it ' s written in
22 this report, then that ' s going to be hearsay. When there was
23 a mention of double hearsay and that ' s when someone says that
24 they heard someone else say and that ' s -- and you are getting
25 more and more hearsay. That ' s what hearsay is. It ' s a
671183
1 statement made outside your presence.
2 COMMISSIONER BRANTER: Okay.
3 MR. KNEPEL : I have knowing further from this
4 witness.
5 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON : Can I ask just a question
6 before -- just on the reading of these, is it possible to
7 determine very quickly from looking at each of these who made
8 the complaint?
9 A Yes, ma 'am. If you are confined to the face
10 sheet, usually the first page, it ' s called the offense sheet,
11 thereby, page 1 of something. Up at the top, you will have
12 the initials r.p. or r.p.v or something.
13 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON : Yes.
L
14 A R.p. is reporting party. So if you see that
15 listed, that should answer your question.
16 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Thank you.
17 CHAIRMAN LACY: Mr. McIntyre.
18 MR. MCINTYRE : I have no further questions. I
19 have no questions of Lieutenant McGuirk.
20 CHAIRMAN LACY: Does the Board have questions.
21 COMMISSIONER SRANTNER: Yes. Lieutenant , you said
22 that there were other calls but there were no reports
23 written, could you expand a little bit on that? If you get a
24 call to respond to east Eaton, for example, there was a fight
25 in progress and you get there and it ' s nothing around, the
871488
1 people have left, that could -- that would be a call without
2 a report and there have been numerous other calls?
3 A Yes, sir. I think I testified to that during the
4 original hearing. Unfortunately, our computer tracking
5 system does not allow us to call up a report run such as this
6 by g. o. code or anything else, if the incident meets our no
7 report criteria. No report criteria would be that everyone
8 involved was g. o. a. , gone on arrival or unable to locate
9 anybody when we got there or in many instances, we are
10 supposed to be responding to someone with a weapon or a fight
11 with weapon or whatever and everyone is gone, say, from one
12 or two people when we get there to talk to and the officers
n-F 13 are given the information of we don' t know what you are
L. J
14 talking about, there was no fight here. We didn ' t see
15 anything, we didn 't hear anything. If it meets that criteria
16 anywhere in the County and it would not be reported in the
17 interest of paperwork saving, I cannot bring that up on a
18 computer run.
1g The only reason I refer to it as numerous over
20 the past year is because part of my job description is I will
21 review a computer run that ' s through dispatch that talks
22 about when the call was received, when the officer was
23 dispatched, when he arrived, when he cleared, that type of
24 thing. I can see on that report the area that it occurred in
1
25 and what the original call was and that ' s the end of the
871.488
1 reporting and there is nothing else in the system. There is
2 no report and I just recall numerous instances in that area
3 of the bar where those criteria were met and that was to this
4 thing I was alluding to.
5 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: Do those reports show the
6 reporting party in those instances?
7 A Not usually, because if there is a reporting
8 party, it ' s not likely that it will be no report. We will
9 contact that person and ask them what they saw or heard 99
10 percent of the time. These types of calls, the reporting
11 party is refused or unknown as far as the name.
12 COMMSSIONER BRANTNER: And would you hazard a
13 guess of the number of calls per month, per year of the area
L
14 of the time period we are looking at, October ' 86 to October
15 '87, would you hazard a guess?
16 A If I hazard a guess, it would be like one or two a
17 month, but that ' s just -- it is a guess. I have nothing to
18 substantiate that.
19 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: Thank you.
20 CHAIRMAN LACY: Mr. McIntyre, do you have any
21 questions after the questioning of Mr. Brantner?
22 MR. MCINTYRE : No.
23 MR. KNEPEL : Nothing further.
24 CHAIRMAN LACY: Okay. Witness is dismissed.
25 MR. KNEPEL : If the Board would permit, I would
871188
K:5
1 bring Deputy Cooke back for one brief question. During the
2 recess, it came to light that he has some information about
3 one of the prior incidents that we discussed that I think
4 perhaps the Board should learn of.
5 JOHN COOKE,
6 a witness herein, having been previously sworn to state
7 the whole truth, testified on his oath as follows :
8 EXAMINATION
9 BY MR. KNEPEL :
10 CHAIRMAN LACY: Would you state your name, again,
11 for the record?
12 A Yes, John Cooke.
r 13 Q (By Mr. Knepel) You have heard the various
L
14 witnesses testify about the incidents we have discussed this
15 morning, is that correct?
16 A That ' s correct.
17 Q You heard Deputy Toft discuss a report he got from
18 a confidential informant, which concerned Tony Rosales, the
19 bartender at this bar, is that correct?
20 A Correct.
21 Q Are you familiar with Mr. Rosales?
22 A Yes, I am.
23 Q And with the current licensee, Miss Faudoa?
24 A Yes.
25 Q Are you aware of any relationship between Mr.
871188
1 Rosales and Miss Faudoa?
2 A Yes. Mr. Rosales is her father.
3 Q So he is more than simply an employee at the bar?
4 A Yes.
5 Q Do you know whether he has worked at this bar any
6 significant length of time?
7 A I just know that he works there. I don 't know how
8 long.
9 MR. KNEPEL : I see. Nothing further.
10 MR. MCINTYRE : No questions.
11 CHAIRMAN LACY: Questions from the Board? Thank
12 you, sir. Mr. McIntyre --
r 1 13 MR. MCINTYRE : Yes, Your Honor.
14 CHAIRMAN: Sure.
15 MR. MCINTYRE : Sorry. Mr. Chairman.
16 CHAIRMAN LACY : That ' s all right. I like to be
17 honored once in awhile.
18 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON : He makes the rest of us
19 call him Your Honor.
20 MR. MCINTYRE : We will call June Faudoa to the
21 stand, please.
22 JUNE FAUDOA,
23 the Applicant herein, having been first duly sworn to state
24 the whole truth, testified on her oath as follows :
L J
25 EXAMINATION
871488
1 BY MR. MCINTYRE :
2 Q For the record, will you please state your name?
3 A June Faudoa.
4 Q And you are the Applicant for the license in this
5 case?
6 A Yes.
7 Q Okay. Now, Miss Faudoa will you tell the Board
8 when you first became connected with the bar now known as La
9 Garra?
10 A In 1976, October 1 .
11 Q Of 1976?
12 A Yes.
_i 13 Q You purchased the bar at that time?
L
14 A Yes.
15 Q Was there a time period where you were not the
16 licensee on the bar?
17 A For two years. I think that was in ' 86 and I came
18 back in ' 86.
19 Q So from ' 84 to ' 86, someone else was the licensee?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And what was his name?
22 A Ernie. Ernie Lamos.
23 Q That ' s when it was known as Ernie ' s Bar, is that
24 correct?
25 A Yes.
87148fl
1 Q It was renamed La Garra after you came back in?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Was that approximately a year ago that you came
4 back in?
5 A Yes.
6 Q Do you remember the exact date?
7 A September 1. That ' s when I got back the premises.
8 Q Now, you have been sitting here during the
9 testimony of the officers, is that correct?
10 A Yes.
11 Q And the other parties that have testified?
12 A Yes.
r-' 13 Q On the December 15th, 1987 incident, that was the
L i
14 sale to -- purported sale to a minor Leon -- let ' s see, I
15 have his name here somewhere, MaDrono?
16 A Right.
17 Q Are you familiar with that incident?
18 A Yes.
19 4 Can you tell the Board how the police happened to
20 call Leon Faudoa? I am sorry, Leon P4aDrono?
21 A Yes, we had gave them the license number, plate
22 number.
23 Q Who do you mean by we?
24 A Well, the ones that ' s got the license plate number
I T
25 gave it to me and then I reported it to the County.
871488
1 Q Who called the County Sheriff ' s in on this
2 incident?
3 A At that tirue, I wasn't there. I had to go check
4 on my babysitter. I think it was my sister. Yes, my sister
5 called. She was working in the bar at that time.
6 Q And complained of a disorderly conduct and
7 criminal mischief?
8 A Yes.
9 Q Who was the criminal mischief against?
10 A The MaDronos.
11 Q I mean what was broken?
12 A A window. A door window.
r-1 13 Q A door window on a vehicle?
L u
14 A No, on the premises.
15 Q Your premises?
16 A Yes.
17 Q So you called the County Sheriff as a victim of an
18 offense committed against your premises?
19 A Yes.
20 Q And then, did they subsequently issue you a
21 summons?
22 A For the under age, 19 year old.
23 Q That was done how much later?
24 A I think about two days later.
25 Q And it ' s your understanding that a friend had come
871488
1 up to the bar, a friend of Leon' s had come up to the bar and
2 took it back and served it to him?
3 A Yes.
4 Q With regard to the testimony of the incident
5 involving Miss Loma Garcia, were you present in the bar at
6 that time?
7 A No, I wasn ' t.
8 Q Who was working in the bar at that time?
9 A Francisco Gallegos.
10 Q And his relationship to you?
11 A Is brother-in-law.
12 Q Do you know whether he at any time did request a
13 drink?
L J
14 A I wasn ' t there. I don ' t think so.
15 Q Was the case on that subsequently dismissed in
16 Court?
17 A Yes.
18 Q The incident involving Mr. Vialpando, Vialpando,
19 that was -- I am sorry, that was Investigator Cooke.
20 Investigator Cooke had discussed that one. Were you present
21 in the bar when that one occurred?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And how did he happen to be served?
24 A He looked over 21 to me and he was with --
I
25 Q He came in with his mother?
871488
1 A Uh-huh.
2 Q Did you ask her whether he was over 21?
3 A Yes. She vouched for him.
4 Q She vouched for him?
5 A Uh-huh.
6 Q Did you know her?
7 A Personally?
8 Q Well, I mean is she a customer there?
9 A Yes.
10 Q And you were issued a ticket on that one, is that
11 correct?
12 A No.
13 Q You were not?
L
14 A Huh-uh.
15 Q With regard to the incident on September 27th,
16 1987 that Deputy Toft testified to, do you know where that
17 particular incident occurred?
18 A It was outside. In front of their aunt ' s house.
19 Q Where is their aunt ' s house in relation to the
20 bar?
21 A It ' s like catty corner, because I live right next
22 door to her, to the aunt.
23 Q La Garra bar is on what side of the street?
24 A On the east.
25 Q On the east side?
871488
1 A No, on the west side.
2 Q West side and your house is on the east?
3 A East.
4 Q Directly across the street?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And the aunt lives where from you?
7 A Right next door on the east side.
8 Q And did the fight occur where as far as you know?
9 A I would say right in that area. Right in front of
10 the house.
11 Q Was any of them in the bar or on the bar premises?
12 A It was outside on the outside.
13 Q Had the supposed victim and the suspect been in
L J
14 the bar that afternoon? They were husband and wife, as I
15 understand?
16 A I think they came in about 11 : 30 . They only had
17 two to three beers. He told her let ' s go. She refused so we
18 closed the bar and that ' s when they took it outside, I guess,
19 because that ' s when --
20 Q You were closing the bar?
21 A Yes. The bar was closed. We were closing.
22 Q There was no fight in the bar?
23 A No.
24 Q There were more people involved in the dispute
J 25 across the street than just the victim and suspect, is that
871488
1 correct?
2 A And sisters and brothers.
3 Q They were all related?
4 A They were all related.
5 Q Are you aware whether there has been any other
6 similar fights within that family in other locations?
7 A Yes.
8 Q On how many occasions, do you know?
9 A Well, here in Greeley. In the City of Greeley,
10 that ' s where they have them.
11 Q Does she live in the City of Greeley?
12 A Uh-huh.
13 Q You know that from people telling you that, I take
L
14 it?
15 A Well , I personally know them.
16 Q You know the people?
17 A Yes.
18 Q With regard to the homicide on March the 15th,
19 1987, where were you at the time the homicide was committed?
20 A Inside the bar. Sitting at the bar.
21 Q And who was seated next to you?
22 A My brother-in-law.
23 Q And on the other side?
24 A The victim.
25 Q Did you see the homicide occur?
1 A Yes.
2 Q Was there any way anyone could have stopped that?
3 A No.
4 Q The weapon was subsequently found in the bathroom,
5 was it not?
6 A Yes.
7 Q Who called the police to tell them to search the
8 bathroom?
9 A It was just an anonymous phone call .
10 Q To you or to the police?
11 A To the bar.
12 Q Okay. Tell the Board what happened?
13 A When they called?
14 Q Yes.
15 A Okay. My dad had went and Tony Rosales went in to
16 purchase some chips for the bar for the week end. As he was
17 going to lock the door to leave and the phone rang and they
18 asked him if he had found the gun and he had said no, so he
19 asked for the name and they refused and he said check the
20 bathroom. So that 's when my dad closed up, told me to call
21 the County.
22 Q You called the County Sheriff 's and told them what
23 had been said?
24 A Yes.
25 Q They then subsequently come up and did find the
1lZnM Al CPO
1 weapon, is that correct?
2 A Yes, and a knife.
3 Q That was because you had called the County and
4 asked them to come up and informed them what you had been
5 told?
6 A Yes.
7 Q Did they find a weapon in the bathroom?
8 A Yes.
9 MR. MCINTYRE: We will have additional evidence if
10 we go to Phase II. As far as Phase I, as to these two
11 matters, is there anything else you wish to tell the Board?
12 That being the subject of the violations that have occurred
r 13 or supposedly occurred and of continuous rowdiness and et
L J
14 cetera, is there anything else you wish to tell the Board?
15 A No.
16 MR. MCINTYRE : Okay. Thank you. I have nothing
17 further of Mrs. Faudoa at this time.
18 EXAMINATION
19 BY MR. KNEPEL:
20 Q Mrs. Faudoa, you say you have owned the bar since
21 about ' 76?
22 A Yes.
23 And then you described, I think it was a two year
24 period where someone else was the licensee, that was Ernie?
25 A Yes.
"7 1 tii ;!
1 Q Lamos?
2 A Uh-huh.
3 Q Other than that person, have you yourself always
4 been the licensee?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And your brother-in-law apparently works in the
7 bar as a bartender?
8 A For that one night, yes, because after the
9 incident of the homicide, it was completely very slow and he
10 just took over just for about two hours for me.
11 0 And your sister works in the bar, is that right?
12 A Yes.
13 Q And your father?
L
14 A Uh-huh.
15 MR. KNEPEL : Nothing further.
16 CHAIRMAN LACY: Board have any questions?
17 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: Mrs. Faudoa, do you hire
18 professional security?
19 A Yes. As of two weeks ago.
20 Q You had no paid security before that?
21 A No.
22 0 Do you have any knowledge that when Ernie, when it
23 was Ernie 's bar that there had been some incidents there and
24 we ask him to provide professional security, do you remember
25 that?
871188
1 A I remember that there was security guards there.
2 Q Was there a reason why you discontinued the use of
3 paid security?
4 A Well, the business had gone down and I couldn ' t
5 afford it, so business looked like it was picking up when the
6 day of the homicide, we were getting a pretty good crowd when
7 that happened and it just went down and I just couldn't
8 afford the security guards, not until lately.
9 CHAIRMAN LACY: Further questions? Thank you.
10 You may be excused.
11 MR. MCINTYRE: We have no further witnesses as to
12 Phase I.
13 CHAIRMAN LACY : At this time, then we will close
14 testimony to Phase I, is that correct?
15 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct. There are two points
16 I would like to make. First of all, there may be some people
17 in the audience, since this is in the nature of a public
18 hearing, they may be here to testify. I would assume they
19 are here to testify on most of those items which would be in
20 Phase II, if you go to Phase II . It 's up to you as to how if
21 there are people in the audience who would like to say
22 something, if you would like to hear them now or if you go
23 into Phase II, if you would like to hear them at that point
24 in time also.
T
25 I am not sure if the two attorneys would like to
R214S8
1 make or if you would like to hear any closing statements at
2 this point in time as to Phase I and those two factors you
3 are looking at there, the first two factors, or if you would
4 like to go ahead and resolve Phase I at this point in time
5 and not allow closing statements.
6 CHAIRMAN LACY: I would ask the Board for their
7 statement on this?
8 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I would like to just ask a
9 couple of questions. Bruce, perhaps you can help me with, in
10 regard to the responsibility of a holder of a liquor license.
11 MR. BARKER: Okay.
12 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: One question is the person
13 who holds that license responsible for monitoring what ' s
L J
14 going on within the premises and I am referring specifically
15 to the fact that someone who had proper i.d. might buy a
16 beverage and then serve it to a friend who was not i . d. 'd?
17 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct. Essentially, Section
18 12-47-128 and I believe it ' s Sub 5, Sub A, deals with the
19 idea of not selling to persons who are under age and that
20 would be under the age of 21 . And specifically there, it
21 talks about -- it says it is unlawful for any person
22 licensed, that would be the licensee, to sell at resale or to
23 sell at retail pursuant to this article and then it goes into
24 to sell malt, vinous, or spirituous liquors to any person
7
L 25 under the age of 21, to a habitual drunkard, et cetera. It
871488
1 then goes on to say or to permit any such person to
2 participate in the sell or dispensing thereof. It can -- I
3 looked at this last night. I think you can interpret that
4 section to mean, and also the sale part of it, to mean if
5 there is alcohol , which is then passed from someone who buys
6 it from the establishment and then passed to someone who is
7 under age, if it ' s done on the premises, that could be
8 considered to be a violation of Subsection 5, Subsection A.
9 And I believe that that was a charge, which was brought up
10 against Miss Faudoa in that one incident.
11 One thing that -- one point I would like to make
12 though, is that if you look at the continuum of violations,
13 that is one which it may be of a lesser extent than just say
14 actually selling to someone right over the counter.
15 Something that is -- I would imagine is hard to control ,
16 given the people who come in and get a large crowd, that can
17 happen, but it is, I would say, a violation of that one
18 subsection.
19 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Second question I had has
20 to do with the responsibility of a licensee in selling to
21 someone who is obviously intoxicated, is there a statutory
22 reference to that?
23 MR. BARKER: Yes, and that ' s the same section,
24 subsection that has been admitted and I believe it was
1
25 amended, I believe it was 1979 and it ' s not in this one, but
871488
1 it does talk about selling to a person and I believe it ' s
2 selling to a person who is visibly intoxicated and so it ' s a
3 determination, if you look at that person and you can tell
4 that that person is intoxicated, then that ' s going to be a
5 violation of that section.
6 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: That answers my questions.
7 MR. MCINTYRE : On behalf of the licensee, I would
8 like to address the Board on this Phase I.
9 CHAIRMAN LACY: That is fine. I do not have a
10 problem with that. I don 't know whether Mr . Knepel .
11 MR. KNEPEL : I guess if we could just address a
12 few short remarks.
r-1
13 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON : I have a question that you
14 may want to address also. Along with the responsibility of
15 the licensee and since it has not been clarified, what, if
16 any, responsibilities they have outside and off the premises.
17 MR. BARKER: Well , the responsibility is one in
18 which in looking at the, you know, again, you are looking at
19 the neighborhood and its effect on the neighborhood of that
20 licensee establishment . Probably the duty on the premises
21 outside of the actual licensee premises, maybe still on the
22 property, is one in which any response to any disturbances
23 that would be out there, i. e. , calling the Sheriff ' s
24 Department if there are disturbances out there. In our
T
25 ordinance 102-A, that is a fact to which considers the
871488
1 rowdiness, et cetera. And I believe it says, which is
2 substantially linked to the result of the operation of the
3 licensed premises. That ' s really what I think you need to
4 look at is, if let ' s say, the fight started or the problem
5 started because of the bar , inside the bar or things were
6 going on inside that moved outside or , you know, people who
7 may have been drinking inside come out and start the fight.
8 It has to be substantially a result of the operation of the
9 licensed premises, so that ' s really the key item that you
10 have to look at.
11 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: Okay.
12 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: I have one more sort of a
13 follow up question. What about the responsibility for order
14 within the establishment , i. e. , things like controlling the
15 advice of someone over a speaker system to resist arrest, to
16 do unlawful acts, if you will?
17 MR. BARKER: Well, I definitely think that that ' s
18 getting closer to being, you know, substantial result of the
19 operation of the licensed premises. If the, you know, the
20 type of patrons who are in the establishment and the mood of
21 what ' s going on in there is such that that is a statement
22 which is brought to arouse the people who are inside the
23 establishment, then that is something in which, you know,
24 possibly could be linked to the establishment itself and its
1
25 existence there, so that ' s something that I think you can
871488
1 consider in that light.
2 MR. MCINTYRE: We are through taking testimony of
3 the witnesses?
4 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct .
5 CHAIRMAN LACY: We are now in final statements.
6 MR. MCINTYRE : Okay. I was going to request
7 permission to reopen in view of something that I just found
8 out.
9 CHAIRMAN LACY: I think we will go ahead with the
10 information with the statements and then when we go into
11 Phase II, why you may possibly bring it up.
12 MR. KNEPEL : To address and sort of summarize some
13 of the testimony you have heard this morning; first, as to
L .
14 the incident of December 13th, 1986, we heard from Deputy
15 Mark Johnson. Now, obviously what he related to you was
16 hearsay. It was a statement to him from Leon MaDrono.
17 However, I would point out to you and I would emphasize that
18 the statement that Mr. MaDrono made to the Deputy was made
19 after a Miranda advisement and by Mr. MaDrono after he knew
20 that he was suspected of a criminal offense in connection
21 with this. I would submit to you that that shows this
22 particular hearsay statement to be reliable, because of the
23 fact that he made that statement against his own interest in
24 a sense, by telling the Deputy what he told them. He gave
25 the Deputy ammunition to bring a criminal charge against him.
871483
1 In connection with that incident, I would also point out that
2 the Statute, Section 12-47-128 (a) not only says you
3 shouldn't, that the licensee or no person is to sell liquor
4 to a minor, but not permit the sale of serving or giving away
5 of alcoholic beverages to a minor and I would submit that on
6 the licensee ' s own premises, that licensee is or ought to be
7 in control . And has a duty to know what ' s going on. The
8 serving of alcholic beverages is sort of a special privilege
9 and a special responsibility and I think it was breached in
10 that particular instance.
11 Next, the shooting incident. March 14th, ' 87,
12 again there is no serious question that that incident
13 actually occurred. Someone is dead because of it and and in
14 fact Mr. Santos, it ' s my understanding, has already pled
15 guilty in connection with that incident to a lesser charge.
16 Again, as to Deputy Cooke ' s taking the statement from the 19
17 year old witness, Robert Vialpando, and again, it ' s hearsay.
18 But again, it ' s a statement made to an officer who is
19 investigating a very serious matter, a homicide. And I would
20 submit to you that under those circumstances, it ' s highly
21 unlikely that this 19 year old lied to the officer . Again, I
22 would submit that that hearsay is credible in that incident.
23 Next, the incident May 22nd, you heard Maria Loma
24 Garcia say, she explained that she paid for the margarita
I 1
25 that she ordered. You saw her. It didn 't appear to me that
871488
1 she looked to be 21 or over . Even if she did, it ' s the
2 licensee ' s, the bartender ' s responsibility to see that the
3 person really is over 21. And that someone looks close isn 't
4 good enough. Again, this is a special responsibility and
5 it ' s the licensee ' s business to make sure that people who are
6 under age are not being served in their establishment.
7 The incident of September 27th, the assault, still
8 one more in a series of incidents at the bar and then in the
9 course of investigating that incident, confidential informant
10 statements comes out indicating that Tony Rosales, the
11 licensee ' s own father and a bartender is counseling people to
12 run from the police, not to submit to arrest without a fight.
13 And in fact, there is the allegation that he was actually the
FT
14 one who moved the murder weapon after the homicide incident.
15 Finally, there is Lieutenant McGuirk ' s report indicating the
16 frequency of the calls for which the Sheriff ' s Office is
17 required to report to this location.
18 Basically, that ' s all I have to say about the
19 incidents. I know we move onto Phase II here.
20 Unfortunately, I also have a trial that I have to attend at
21 11 o'clock, so I had better move on out of here. When you
22 proceed to the next phase, I should point out that Veronica
23 Santos, the wife of the defendant in the homicide incident,
24 which occurred March 14th of ' 87 , is present in the back of
1
25 the room here today and would like to address the Board and
1 impress on them the seriousness and the effect that that
2 incident had on her.
3 CHAIRMAN LACY: Thank you.
4 MR. KNEPEL : With your permission, I would take
5 off to make my Court appearance.
6 CHAIRMAN LACY: Thank you. Permission is granted.
7 MR. KNEPEL : Unless -- I suppose another
8 possibility is to continue the second phase, but I don ' t know
9 how that would sit with the Board or petitioner.
10 CHAIRMAN LACY: I guess that ' s something that we
11 would look at after the decision on Phase I.
12 MR. KNEPEL : If it happens my trial does not go or
13 is over quickly, I will return as soon as possible.
J
14 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: Could we check with his case
15 further in case that should go that way as far as time on say
16 Wednesday? I haven 't had time to think about this. I don ' t
17 know how much time we need for both attorneys.
18 MR. BARKER: It ' s really up to Bob, as far as the
19 weight that, you know, if you think you would need to be here
20 to direct the testimony to Miss Santos and any
21 cross-examination of witnesses that Keith would put forth.
22 MR. KNEPEL : Obviously, that could be helpful .
23 And I apologize, but I do have a full time job and I do have
24 time later today from about 1 o 'clock until 1 : 45 and then I
I
25 believe after 4 o' clock. That 's as far as the schedule for
871488
1 today.
2 MR. BARKER: Excuse me. Go ahead.
3 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: Do you know how you are fixed
4 for Wednesday so when we find out , those would be the
5 alternatives we would have.
6 MR. KNEPEL : This coming Wednesday, I should have
7 free time pretty much at the Board' s convenience.
8 CHAIRMAN LACY: The Board is in a meeting at 9
9 o'clock in the morning and then we will be in hearings at 2
10 o' clock in the afternoon. This also applies to you, Mr.
11 McIntyre.
12 MR. MCINTYRE: I don 't know about my schedule at
13 this point. I would have to call the office and check.
L
14 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: I was just trying to get an
15 alternative.
16 MR. MCINTYRE : It ' s distinctly possible that I
17 would have time on Wednesday, but I don't know at this point.
18 CHAIRMAN LACY: I think we will go ahead with your
19 information, Mr. McIntyre, and then at that time, we will
20 decide on the -- the Board will make its decision on Phase I
21 and then we will decide on whether or not we need to have the
22 attorney for the Sheriff ' s Department here at that time.
23 MR. KNEPEL : Thank you. With your permission, I
24 will take off.
25 CHAIRMAN LACY: Yes.
871488
1 MR. MCINTYRE : Okay. Briefly, I would like to
2 address the Board concerning the situation of whether
3 violations 1 and 2 have occurred as in your resolution,
4 particularly with regard to violation 2 . Let 's start with
5 that violation. It ' s claimed that there is evidence showing
6 excessive noise, rowdiness or disturbances exist on a
7 continuous basis in the immediate area of the licensed
8 premises, which has been substantially as a result of the
9 operation of the licensed premises.
10 What we have in dealing with this is, I guess, to
11 some extent speculation and innuendo as well as fact. We
12 have Officer McGuirk who says, well , he believes there is one
13 or two calls a month. We have this sheet that goes before
L
14 the Board that shows twelve contacts over the year, four of
15 which were testified to here. In briefly skimming through
16 those, I did not have an adequate opportunity to go through
17 them in detail, but in briefing skimming through, I notice
18 that a portion of those occurred off the premises with I
19 don't know what connection with the bar. They were in the --
20 as he called it, a g. o. something or something or other.
21 Sergeant McGuirk or Lieutenant McGuirk did say
22 within a square mile of the bar and what their connection is,
23 I don 't know. That 's not something we have had an
24 opportunity to really look over or be able to consider at
25 this point, but just by looking at them, a number of those do
871488
1 not connect with the bar. I don't think that there is any
2 showing of excessive noise, rowdiness or disturbances on a
3 continuous basis that relates substantially to the bar. Two
4 of the incidents at least also have -- two, and and perhaps
5 three of those incidents, there was nothing there. One was a
6 phone call that was either a fire or a fight and they
7 couldn 't tell from listening to the tape whether it said fire
8 or fight. But there was nothing there of either sort and,
9 you know, no fire, no fight. And there was another that was
10 shown there was nothing involved with when the police got
11 there.
12 So several of those are the type of incidents that
F
13 officer McGuirk was talking about, no report, and yet there
L 1
14 are reports found on them in there. So whether there is a
15 factual basis, whether someone is calling, we don 't know.
16 All we know is we are the ones now that it ' s being thrown
17 back on with no connection.
18 Let ' s take a look a little bit at -- I am not
19 going to play games with the Board. I am not going to say
20 that the service of the Miss Loma and I have forgotten her
21 last name, Miss Loma Garcia, that was improper. We admit
22 that . That was a violation, although it was subsequently
23 dismissed in Court. Her i . d. should have been checked.
24 Whether or not she looks like she is 21 to someone who is
25 used to checking i .d. 's and seeing whether they are is
671488
1 another question. But we would admit that, you know, she
2 should have never been served by the bartender that served
3 her without being checked.
4 As far as the first one, which relates to, I
5 believe it was Mr. MaDrono. Mr. Knepel made much of the fact
6 that he was suspected of crimes against the bar and,
7 therefore, his hearsay is probably reliable. If he was
8 suspected against a crime against the bar, I would suspect
9 his hearsay was not reliable. The bar was the victim. What
10 better way to get your own back at them. But even assuming
11 that did occur, that it is a violation by the bar owners, it
12 is perhaps the hardest one for the bar owners to deal with.
I 13 The only way you can do that is to exclude permanently from
L. j
14 your establishment anybody -- anyone under the age of 21 and
15 check at the door. But if you allow anybody to come in with
16 families, then that ' s always a risk . And that ' s not
17 something that can always be supervised and if it ' s a
18 violation, and I am not sure that it is a violation, frankly,
19 but if it is one, I would view that one, as Mr. Barker
20 indicated, the least severe of all , but because that ' s
21 something that ' s very difficult to avoid unless you are just
22 strictly restricting to people only over the age of 21.
23 With regard to the other individual and I have
24 forgotten his name that came in with his mother, I think
25 Vialpando, that came in with his mother. Granted, they
637.14 AR
1 should have pursued the i.d. and not served when he didn't
2 have an i.d. , but they relied on the mother ' s statement, but
3 that ' s, you know, that again is a technical violation.
4 So we are not saying there aren' t some technical
5 violations that have occurred here. We are saying that these
6 violations shouldn 't result in a revocation of this license.
7 The question is, you know, let ' s talk a little bit about the
8 purported hiding of the gun or a knife or I guess it was a
9 gun, a weapon anyway. Look at what was said. We are getting
10 a double hearsay from someone who apparently wasn 't present,
11 saying that she had heard someone say that Anthony Rosales
12 hid the gun. On the other hand, if someone heard that
13 Antonio Rosales was the one who told the police where to find
L _
14 the gun, they might suspect he was the one who hid it and
15 that could have been where that came came from.
16 There is absolutely no indication that he was
17 involved in that except as Miss Faudoa testified to, an
18 anonymous phone call which they then turned and immediately
19 called the Sheriff as they should do and got the Sheriff out
20 there and told them what the anonymous phone call said. And
21 yet it ' s coming back to haunt them, because supposedly it was
22 Mr . Rosales who hid the gun. Who says this? An unidentified
23 person being a confidential informant -- I don 't know how
24 confidential it is. We have the name in our file, but an
_1
25 unidentified person on this record who says that she heard
8'71.488
1 someone else say something about this. Totally unidentified
2 and I would submit totally without merit for you to consider
3 in this matter.
4 As far as the subject of the loud speaker that I
5 believe Mr. Kirby asked about. If you go back and listen to
6 the record or read the record on what was said, everything
7 that was said there with the exception of the final phrase
8 attributed to Mr. Rosales was perfectly correct and perfectly
9 legal . Everything he said, you have rights. Do not be
10 afraid. Do not be harassed. That ' s what he told them. Only
11 the last phrase is the part that would be questionable. If
12 in fact that was said, and here again, we have the
13 unidentified -- we have the unidentified witness who
14 purportedly said this and we don't even know whether she
15 heard it herself or whether someone else heard. I would
16 submit that if we do get to Phase II, you would get some
17 evidence on that. That ' s the evidence I discovered after the
18 evidence had been closed. But if we get there, you will hear
19 what was said.
20 But I would submit that that is not anything upon
21 which to base a revocation of my client ' s license. I would
22 submit that based on it, there is no continuous -- I don 't
23 want to read it again but that item 2, that there are some
24 technical violations, yes, which you could find and take us
25 onto Phase I, I am sorry, onto Phase II, if you wish to do
871488
1 that. I would submit, however, that under the circumstances
2 that it is not justified going to Phase II and we would ask
3 that the license be renewed at this point.
4 We would certainly have no objection if you wanted
5 to wait to make your decision and consider it , if we are
6 going to move it to Wednesday or making it today, either one.
7 You know, we would also submit that in this case and this is
8 not the first time this has come up, but in this case we are
9 dealing with -- we are not insurers of the peace outside of
10 our premises. We have no right to walk across the street to
11 the aunt ' s house and control a fight over there. We are not
12 policemen. We can try to control people on our premises and
13 that ' s it. We can not control people across the street. And
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14 yet, it appears that part of the Sheriff ' s Department
15 presentation here is pretending that we can. We can't. If
16 trouble starts in the premises, we can stop it, but it can
17 resume off the premises.
18 With regard to the shooting on the premises.
19 There has been absolutely no presentation as to what if any
20 connection that had with the premises other than it occurred
21 there. If that man had met the victim elsewhere, would the
22 shooting have occurred? We don't know. What connection does
23 that have, other than the fact that it did in fact occur
24 there? We would submit that there is insufficient -- not
25 that there is insufficient -- certainly with the violations,
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1 I think there is insufficient evidence as to part 2 . But as
2 to part 1, we would submit that in the wisdom of this Board
3 it agree to the renewal of the license and not go to Phase II
4 as to that aspect . Thank you.
5 CHAIRMAN LACY: At this time, it is the authority
6 of the Board to decide on Phase I, is that correct, Mr.
7 Barker?
8 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct.
9 CHAIRMAN LACY: These are the four items that are
10 listed on the sheet that we have that deal with whether there
11 have been any violations in the last one year period. Two,
12 evidence showing excessive noise, rowdiness or disturbance.
13 In number 2 is evidence showing excessive noise, rowdiness or
14 disturbances on a continuous basis in the immediate area.
15 Three, is evidence that a persons
or person convicted under
16 section 42-4-1202 , CRS, of driving under the influence. And
17 four, is evidence that the licensee is no longer of fit
18 character.
19 MR. BARKER: Mr. Chairman, I guess in accordance
20 with the probable cause hearing, and given that the
21 resolution which stated the two items that you found probable
22 cause on a week ago, included factors one and two only, in
23 the interest of fairness and of notice, I believe that those
24 are the two -- those are the two that I would be specifically
25 looking at.
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1 CHAIRMAN LACY: Okay, thank you. Then in other
2 words, we are are basically looking at one and two under
3 Phase I?
4 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct.
5 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Mr. Chairman, I move to
6 find that there is good cause to find that there have been
7 violations or that evidence has shown that both of these
8 conditions exist. In the case of the first one, number 1 , I
9 believe that there is sound evidence of several violations
10 and I think whether they are technical or not, there is a
11 continuation -- there is more than one and a representation
12 of the laxness in terms of meeting the requirements of the
13 Code, both in terms of serving to minors under varying
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14 conditions, as well as I think it ' s some evidence of service
15 of the persons who were intoxicated and ought not to have
16 been served further .
17 I think that second point relates then to number 2
18 in our findings because it appears to me, at least that to
19 some degree, the conditions which existed outside the bar or
20 even within the bar as far as the incidents with regard to
21 the homicide are at least in part contributorily created by
22 the fact that persons who have consumed too much alcohol
23 continue to be served and so I would say that there is in
24 both cases evidence of preponderance of evidence that to show
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25 that these conditions existed.
fl1 ,IQQ
1 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: Seconded.
2 CHAIRMAN LACY : It ' s a motion by Jackie, seconded
3 by Gene as above stated. At this time, we would take further
4 discussion by the Board. There being no further discussions,
5 all in favor of the motion say aye.
6 (Ayes voiced. )
7 CHAIRMAN LACY: All opposed same sign. Motion is
8 carried.
9 Now, Mr. Barker, we proceed to Phase II, is that
10 correct? And at this time, we take further information and
11 also testimony from other people or from the same people that
12 were with us in Phase I, is that correct?
F-; 13 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct . Specifically, you
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14 are looking at Phase II is a determination of whether certain
15 items mitigate or aggravate the effects of the two factors
16 that you have found to exist . Specifically, I can read
17 through those, if you would like me to. There are factors A
18 through K in ordinance 102-A.
19 MR. MCINTYRE : Might I raise a question at this
20 point? Are we going to continue?
21 CHAIRMAN LACY : I am about to take off with that.
22 MR. BARKER: So that ' s it. It ' s up to you I think
23 at this point since Bob had to leave. If you would like to
24 hear the evidence as to Phase I at this point in time or
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25 continue it .
1 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: Mr . Chairman, do we know what
2 we have in the way of such items this afternoon? Can they be
3 rearranged so we can continue right after lunch? I guess the
4 Board needs to make that decision.
5 CHAIRMAN LACY: Well, not only do we need to make
6 that decision, Mr. McIntyre, or Mr. Knepel to be here for a
7 short period of time this afternoon, 45 minutes, from 1 to
8 1: 45 . I would say that it would be up to Mr. McIntyre
9 whether he could be here at that time.
10 MR. MCINTYRE : I would have difficulty this
11 afternoon in all honesty. I think I have some time available
12 Wednesday, but this afternoon, it would be extremely --
—-i 13 COMMISSIONER KIRBY : I think the very accessible
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14 time would be Wednesday maybe after the meeting. The morning
15 meeting.
16 MR. MCINTYRE : I don 't anticipate it will take as
17 long as this Phase I.
18 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: I wouldn 't think so. I am
19 willing to go either direction, but I hate having counselor
20 for part of --
21 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON : I do too, Bill.
22 COMMISSIONER KIRBY: -- this process and not the
23 complete process. It seems somehow something as serious as
24 this that that is not doing a good job.
25 CHAIRMAN LACY: I have another question also and
871488
1 this is directed both at Bruce and Mr. McIntyre. We have
2 some people here in the audience who have came here the
3 second time to possibly make a statement. Would it be
4 possible to take that statement? Would you have a problem
5 with that?
6 MR. MCINTYRE : I don' t have any problem.
7 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: I think the point was
8 though counselor from the officers indicated that he felt
9 that it might be helpful for him to direct the questioning.
10 CHAIRMAN LACY: I guess so. The only thing I was
11 looking at there was the possibility of these people not
12 having to come back again, which to them has to be a
13 distasteful thing to, you know, to continue to come back for
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14 this and for the matters to be brought up.
15 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON: Mr. McIntyre, you think you
16 could be available on Wednesday say at 9: 30?
17 CHAIRMAN LACY: Let ' s take about a two minute
18 recess.
19 (Short recess taken. )
20 CHAIRMAN LACY: Mr. McIntyre.
21 MR. MCINTYRE : Yes. Mr . Chairman, I can be
22 available 9: 30 Monday morning.
23 CHAIRMAN LACY: Wednesday morning .
24 MR. MCINTYRE : For the remainder of the morning.
25 I don't anticipate it will take that long.
671:6,88
1 CHAIRMAN LACY: 9: 30 Wednesday morning and I think
2 Mr. Knepel stated that he would be available Wednesday most
3 any time.
4 MR. BARKER: That ' s correct .
5 CHAIRMAN LACY : So with that in mind --
6 COMMISSIONER JOHNSON : I would move to continue to
7 Wednesday on the 21st at 9: 30 a.m.
8 COMMISSIONER BRANTNER: Second.
9 CHAIRMAN LACY: Motion by Jackie, seconded by Gene
10 to continue to Wednesday morning 9: 30 a.m. . This is
11 Wednesday October 21st. No discussion? All in favor of the
12 motion, say aye.
13 (Ayes voiced. )
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14
CHAIRMAN LACY: All opposed, same sign. Motion is
15 carried.
16 MR. MCINTYRE : Thank you.
17 (Whereupon, Commissioner recessed at the
18 approximate hour of 11 : 00 a.m. )
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Q'71 ,1,Qsd
1 CERTIFICATE
2
3 I, MABEL BROYLES, Certified Shorthand Reporter
4 within an for the State of Colorado, do hereby certify
5 that I was present and reported in Stenotypy the forgoing
6 proceedings before the Weld County Commissioners.
7 I further certify that the above and foregoing 79
8 pages contain a transcript of said proceedings and that the
9 same is true and correct .
10
DATED this ./,7(-•( day of � �x�F� , 1987 .
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///��
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M 1 Byles
15 Certified Shorthand Reporter
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