HomeMy WebLinkAbout20003329.tiff 186
BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS
WELD COUNTY
PUBLIC HEARING RE : DYELAND DAIRY LLC
915 10th Street
Greeley , Colorado
December 13 , 2000
( 10 : 49 a . m . - 4 : 17 p . m . )
VOLUME III
Reported by Wilson George Court Reporters
Mary J . George , AMR , CRR
Wilson George Court Reporters, Inc.
One Old Town Square, Suite 200 B, Ft. Collins, CO 80524 (970) 224-3000
303 E. 17th Avenue, Suite 700, Denver, CO 80203 (303) 861-5000
Greeley, CO (970) 353-0300 (800) 845-3001 2000-3329
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1 INDEX
2 PAGE
3 PUBLIC COMMENTS ( Continued ) 189
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1 WHEREUPON , the following proceedings were
2 had :
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : All right . Next
4 docket up is docket No . 2000-72 . It ' s , for the
5 board , is PL-1454 . We will essentially reconvene the
6 hearing , public hearing , for the site specific
7 development plan and use by special review permit
8 No . 1289 .
9 MR . MORRISON : While you ' re doing that , I
10 do have one housekeeping issue .
11 Exhibit PP , which is the large aerial map ,
12 Mr . Tracy Eichheim , after the first hearing at the
13 suggestion of Commissioner Hall , penciled in areas to
14 identify ditches and roads and drainage ponds and
15 some items that had come up . So that those were
16 added and are now part of that exhibit .
17 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Thank you .
18 Okay . I believe when we recessed this
19 hearing , we were in the middle of the public hearing ,
20 and Mr . Mullins was actually in the middle of his
21 testimony .
22 So if Mr . Mullins would please come back up
23 to the microphone . And again I apologize for having
24 to interrupt you yesterday .
25 Again , we ask that everybody in the
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1 public -- when they ' re testifying for the public ,
2 that they do not repeat or that -- and that they also
3 keep their comments relevant to the case in point .
4 And , Mr . Mullins , just for the record ,
5 please , if you wouldn ' t mind identifying yourself and
6 giving your address and then start into your comments
7 again .
8 MR . KEITH MULLINS : My name is Keith
9 Mullins . I live at 41545 Weld County Road 15 .
10 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Thank you .
11 MR . KEITH MULLINS : When we stopped the
12 other day , I had made the statement that the -- there
13 was a new site plan that had appeared in the file
14 just prior to the meeting last Wednesday . And this
15 site plan is , in my opinion , considerably different
16 than the one that had been in there all along and
17 the -- I have a -- I have an overhead of that -- of
18 the new site plan .
19 And I have also made a -- because it ' s not
20 easy to see how it is different , I ' ve made an overlay
21 over the one that was on the map .
22 The net effect of the new site plan is that
23 the entire project has been shifted to the north by
24 about 200 feet and that the compost area has been
25 increased by about 50 percent .
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1 Because of the -- because of the movement
2 and especially the increase of the compost area , I
3 would expect that the -- there would need to be new
4 calculations on the runoff , on the size of the
5 retention ponds , you know , a lot of things .
6 I mean , we ' re talking about -- I mean , I ' m
7 just estimating , but another , at least , 4 or 5 acres .
8 The other effect that this has is , is that it reduces
9 the -- the overall farmable land remaining .
10 Part of the -- part of their plan is to
11 have 90 acres of corn to pump the effluent onto in
12 the case of a storm . Well , I don ' t know , at the --
-- 13 at the moment , they have moved the compost area edge
14 right to the half mile , so , you know , I ' m not a --
15 I ' m a farmer but I ' m not an expert in , you know , how
16 these things are , but it would appear to me that ,
17 number one , the addition of a new site plan at this
18 point is a little -- well , maybe not within the
19 rules ; I don ' t know the rules , though . I guess I
20 would just ask that question of you .
21 The -- the planned placement of the sewage
22 lagoons for these 4 , 000 cows were approximately a
23 quarter of a mile from my house , actually a little
24 less . The -- and now with this move , they ' re
25 actually closer . And I guess my feeling is that I
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1 don ' t think anyone in this room would be willing to
2 live that close to a sewage lagoon .
3 The -- because we are -- because we are
4 downwind -- downhill , from -- I didn ' t mean to say
5 downwind , I meant downhill . We ' re downhill from this
6 site , in the summer evenings as the air cools , all
7 the air moves downhill so , you know , yes , we have
8 strong winds out of the west and the north , but the
9 days that we don ' t have strong winds , the winds
10 actually -- and the air moves actually the other
11 direction .
12 So I -- I ' m -- you know , I ' m very concerned
13 about the -- you know , the smell , the dust , the
14 whatever that ' s going to just infiltrate , you know ,
15 down on top of me .
16 The other question that I have is , is about
17 the groundwater . There ' s been some discussion about
18 what the groundwater level is in this area , but I , in
19 fact , have an old hand-dug well on my property and I
20 know that the water level table -- or the table --
21 the level of the water just a week ago was 7-1 / 2 feet
22 under the ground .
23 And I don ' t -- it ' s going to be very , very
24 difficult for them to control the nutrient seepage .
25 And I also have a -- a livestock well that we use for
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1 watering our livestock . And I certainly , you know ,
2 don ' t want to see this contaminated .
3 I think Mr . Jiricek will confirm that
4 the -- when they opened up that tailwater pond to the
5 groundwater , especially in its location , which is
6 only 40 or 50 feet from the present corrals on that
7 place , that that ' s kind of a disregard for the rules
8 and , you know -- well , I guess I ' ll just -- I ' ll
9 leave that at that .
10 According to the nutrient management plan ,
11 the 4 , 000 cows excrete approximately 158 tons of
12 manure a day , which is converted into 32 tons of
13 compost . The nutrient plan states that this is
14 intended to be used by farmers , landscapers and
15 gardeners . And that ' s as far as it goes .
16 Well , most farmers don ' t use manure from
17 other sites anymore because it ' s too expensive . You
18 know , the application is just -- is just too costly .
19 Farmers probably wouldn ' t use compost anyway because
20 the -- there ' s not enough nutrient left in it . They
21 use manure but not compost .
22 So it kind of appears to me that all that ' s
23 left is landscapers and gardeners to take 30-plus
24 tons of compost a day out of this facility . And I ,
25 for one , am not sure that that market even exists .
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1 If you look at the -- if you look at the feedlots and
2 dairies around us , these piles tend to just get
3 bigger and bigger and bigger , which is an indication
4 to me that it ' s just not as easy to get rid of as one
5 might hope .
6 I think the -- I think the comments that
7 Mr . Snyder made the other day in the case that was
8 two ahead of us , where a subdivision was proposed
9 beside his feedlot , are very applicable to this
10 situation . I mean , he basically said that , you know ,
11 how can you put a subdivision next to this feedlot
12 because of all the noise , the dust , the manure , the
13 flies , the hay dust , everything else?
14 And this , in my opinion , is a very similar
15 situation . This area is already in place and a
16 fairly dense residential population . And to put a
17 feedlot in next to it -- or a dairy in next to it
18 just doesn ' t make any sense to me .
19 In closing , I ' d like to say that the
20 primary reason -- or reasons , given that the planning
21 commission gave approval of this dairy , was that
22 Mr . Dye was a good dairyman , a good neighbor ,
23 et cetera , et cetera . Well , in my opinion , that
24 really doesn ' t have any anything to do with it .
25 You can correct me if I ' m wrong , but if
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1 this USR is granted , it is a part of that land and
2 whether -- whether the -- the land -- whether Mr . Dye
3 decides to sell it or build a dairy and then sell it
4 would be quite feasible . In fact , having this USR
5 probably makes the land more valuable for resale . So
6 I think that the justification that they used as to
7 his personal qualities and abilities have absolutely
- 8 nothing to do with the granting of this permit .
9 The permit has to be granted on the basis
10 of , does it really fit on this piece of ground in
11 this community?
12 So with that , I will close and I thank you
13 very much .
14 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Thank you .
15 Questions? George .
16 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Quick question , just
17 a clarification . You mentioned other piles of -- you
18 didn ' t clarify whether that was manure , or what , on
19 other facilities . Other facilities in the area , are
20 they composting the manure or is it just being used
21 as manure?
22 MR . KEITH MULLINS : Well , Cactus Hill is
23 one that I was kind of referring to and they do some
24 sort of a composting , I ' m not sure that it ' s exactly
25 the same composting system as this . But I know that
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1 their manure piles just get bigger and bigger and
2 bigger .
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Mike .
4 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Yesterday you had
5 mentioned that you ' d offered $ 1 . 3 million for the
6 278 acres -- or excuse me , there had been -- I guess
7 you were involved with it .
8 MR . KEITH MULLINS : It was not -- it was
9 not 278 acres , it was the -- it was the farm that the
10 dairy is actually on . This -- this is -- the thing
11 is in two pieces . The old property line is right
12 where that dashed line is and we were offering to buy
13 this farm , which is about 200 acres .
14 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Which is , what , about
15 5 , 000 an acre?
16 MR . KEITH MULLINS : Yeah . A little more .
17 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Okay . Thank you .
18 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : All right . Any
19 other questions for Mr . Mullins ? Thank you very
20 much .
21 MR . KEITH MULLINS : You ' re welcome .
22 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . We ' re still
23 in the public hearing . Is there anyone else in the
24 audience who would like to come forward at this time
25 who has not had the opportunity to testify?
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1 MS . PAM ERTHAL : I ' m Pam Erthal . I live at
2 40907 Weld County Road 15 . Basically , I live right
3 across the street in this parcel right here . Right
4 here in the corner is where I live , downwind of the
5 dairy .
6 We ' ve lived here for -- we ' ve lived here --
7 we ' ve owned the property for 5 years and lived here
8 for 3-1 / 2 , although we do pretty much the same as a
9 lot of neighbors , I raise hay , have a flock of sheep ,
10 we ' re raising a family . I ' m concerned about a couple
11 of things that I ' ve noticed in our farming .
12 The property -- I ' ve noticed that the --
13 you know , these things have been brought up , I guess ,
14 before , but the land erodes very easily , we have a
15 real hard time with noxious weeds , especially
16 Canadian thistle . And this property has some in this
17 corner here , along in the existing berm area , which
18 will have to be dealt with .
19 And I ' m also -- I haven ' t seen anything in
20 any of the plans , what that corner is going to do --
21 what they ' re going to do with that corner . So I sort
22 of would be interested in finding out what they ' re
23 going to do with this little triangle down here . So
24 those are things that I ' m concerned about .
25 We also -- last summer , we did have
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1 problems renting water , we own some shares and we
2 also rent some . And , you know , it was a -- it was an
3 unusual summer . It was a drought . But the water can
4 be very difficult to rent . And it was last summer
5 and some people weren ' t able to get as much as they
6 wanted , me and the neighbor across the street .
7 I wanted to speak briefly about the support
8 letters for the dairy . There are 13 in the record
9 from suppliers , the majority of those are from
10 Larimer County . He ' s a Larimer County producer now ,
11 so -- so less than 50 percent were from Weld County .
12 He ' s a -- he lives in Larimer County now , moving in a
13 mile to the east , I expect that will remain the same ,
14 that he ' ll still be dealing mainly with Larimer
15 County suppliers .
16 There ' s a lot of -- a lot of testimony , and
17 I agree with my neighbors , that there ' s some real
18 concern with this area . My son spoke last week and
19 he , I thought , was more eloquent than I could -- he
20 was the one at the end Wednesday about , you know , why
21 we don ' t want the dairy to come . So that ' s all I
22 need -- I have to say .
23 Thank you .
24 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay , just a second .
25 Any questions ?
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1 COMMISSIONER GEILE : May I ?
2 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Go ahead .
3 COMMISSIONER GEILE : The land immediately
4 to the east of where you live , and I guess you might
5 say the east kind of a strip that goes north , this is
6 pretty densely populated , isn ' t it? And I ' m talking
7 about to the east . If you were to take -- if you
8 were you to go to Cactus Hill ' s ditch and run that up
9 the hill --
10 MS . PAM ERTHAL : Here?
11 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Yeah . If you were to
12 run that up the hill and go east , isn ' t this pretty
13 sparsely populated?
14 MS . PAM ERTHAL : Oh , this is a dryland
15 area , yeah , this is --
16 COMMISSIONER GEILE : How far --
17 MS . PAM ERTHAL : Four generations and
18 there ' s no one living in this property . There ' s --
19 COMMISSIONER GEILE : How far south does
20 that dryland dairy go?
21 MS . PAM ERTHAL : It goes to this county
22 road over here . Then there ' s people that live up in
23 here . But this whole area , yeah , is a -- it ' s
24 just -- it never had anything done with it . There ' s
25 a little house right here that ' s vacant but there ' s
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1 no one that lives there .
2 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Thank you .
3 MS . PAM ERTHAL : Oh-huh .
4 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Any other questions
5 for Mrs . Erthal ? Thank you .
6 All right . Is there anyone else in the
7 audience who hasn ' t had an opportunity to testify
8 yet?
9 MR . KIRK KIMBERLING : Hi , my name is Kirk
10 Kimberling . I live at 6621 Weld County Road 84 . And
11 I guess I ' d like to use this map . Let ' s see here .
12 Is that the one? I guess I ' m not following . Okay .
13 We basically are a quarter mile to the west of County
14 Road 15 on 84 .
15 Today I ' d like to voice my strong
16 opposition to the proposed 4 , 000-cow dairy . The
17 66-acre farm where we live is located between
18 Mr . Dye ' s current dairy to the west and his proposed
19 dairy site to the east . Essentially we will be among
20 a 6 , 000-cow dairy if the permit is approved .
21 The traffic generated between the two
22 dairies will pass by our house on County Road 84 .
23 Our home is 85 feet north of this road . The farm
24 where we live is owned and operated -- or owned -- is
25 owned by my parents , Betty and Cleon Kimberling .
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1 They ' ve owned this property since 1968 . My sister
2 and I grew up on this farm , and my wife and I have
3 lived here 17 years .
4 Our daughter is 10 years old and enjoys
5 living nearby her grandparents and does not wish to
6 live anywhere else . Over the years , several
7 improvements have been made to our property including
8 two windbreaks , which in total have approximately 700
9 mature trees . One of our latest improvements has
10 been a PVC gated pipe irrigation system which covers
11 a 24—acre grass alfalfa pasture .
12 The point I would like to make is as a
13 family we have made these -- many other improvements
14 to this farm to enhance our quality of life we have
15 here today .
16 The -- if the proposed dairy is allowed to
17 proceed , our life , and the lives of those in our
18 community , will forever be altered to our collective
19 detriment . A square peg does not fit in a round hole
20 and a 4 , 000-cow dairy does not fit in our community .
21 And that ' s it .
22 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Board have
23 any questions ? All right . Thank you .
24 MR . KIRK KIMBERLING : Thank you .
25 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Is there anyone
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1 else?
2 MS . BETTY KIMBERLING : My name is Betty
3 Kimberling . I live at 6615 Weld County Road 84 . Our
4 farm is immediately to the west of the proposed
5 dairy .
6 Many of my concerns have been addressed so
7 I will combine my remarks to three issues . By 1992 ,
8 the traffic on County Road 15 and 84 increased due to
9 heavy truck traffic . This created a dust problem for
10 the families living along these roads . The dust
_ 11 caused illness in some residents and their livestock .
12 The community approached the County to have them pave
13 these roads . Funds were not available as this was
14 not a priority item for the County .
15 The community , in cooperation with Anheuser
16 Busch , raised the money to pave these segments of
17 County Road 84 and County Road 15 . Each household
18 along County Road 15 and 84 contributed $ 3 , 500 if
19 they owned one parcel , and if you own two parcels ,
20 you paid $7 , 000 . These roads were paved at no
21 expense to the County or other taxpayers . This
22 solved the respiratory problems .
23 If this 4 , 000-cow dairy permit passes , we
24 have created this same health issue for the families
25 living along the south side of the dairy . The dust
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1 from grinding hey and other activities will also
2 create a health problem for these residents .
3 One resident who lives immediately across
4 the road from the main access to the dairy has a
5 heart and respiratory condition . The combination of
6 dust will force her to leave her home after 51 years
7 in the community . This will be a loss of one of my
8 dearest friends and caring person .
9 The previous owner of the proposed dairy
10 site who we neighbored with for 32 years was an
11 excellent farmer . He did an excellent job of weed
12 control . There were no weeds around the buildings ,
13 corrals , and along the road ditches . He was
14 constantly in control of noxious weeds in his fields .
15 This was not the case this past season .
16 The water -- the waste water from one of the small
17 plots of the proposed dairy passes through our
18 property . The former owner felt it was his duty to
19 keep the ditch clean allowing the water to pass into
20 the large irrigation canal where that water
21 eventually winds up at Black Hollow , which is now a
22 private resort .
23 This past season the sediment from the
24 waste water clogged the ditch , buried grass in our
25 pasture where our sheep feed , and washed deep ruts
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1 through our shelter belt . We rented a backhoe at the
2 cost of $ 279 and we cleaned the ditch . But one thing
3 about it is we never complained to the Dyes .
4 If Mr . Dye receives this 4 , 000—cow dairy
5 permit , this makes his farm very marketable . If he
6 decides to sell something else in the future and his
7 granddaughter does not care to be involved with the
8 dairy business , he can sell this because this is a
9 marketable piece of property now . Another dairy can
10 come in and buy this because the permit will be there
11 and they can expand .
12 And there is no guarantee that this new
13 owner will have the same high standards as Mr . Dye .
14 If the permit for the 4 , 000-cow dairy is approved ,
15 the marketability of our 66 acres of farm ground will
16 be greatly reduced . I know that no one will want to
17 live in a nice rural setting that has a 2 , 000-cow
18 dairy a half mile to the west and a 4 , 000-cow dairy
19 across the road to the east .
20 I would appreciate it very much if you
21 would consider the health and the well-being of the
22 members in our community when you make your final
23 decision on this 4 , 000-cow dairy permit .
24 Thank you .
25 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Does the board have
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1 any questions? Okay . Thank you very much .
2 Okay . Next?
3 MR . FRANK SEWALD : My name is Frank
4 Sewald . I live at 7496 Weld County Road 84 . It ' s
5 right here .
6 Most everything has been covered what I was
7 going to talk about . I am not against the
8 right-of-use for Mr . Dye to have a 1100-cow dairy ,
9 but I am totally against the permit for 4 , 000 . This
10 is not compatible with our small hobby-type farms and
11 retired people that live in this area .
12 Mr . Dye had never made any attempt to
13 contact any of the surrounding neighbors before
14 purchasing this property for this proposed dairy . I
15 feel that Mr . Dye showed complete disregard for me ,
16 my family , and my neighbors .
17 I purchased my property with the intent of
18 keeping a piece of Weld County in farming to pass on
19 to my children and grandchildren . I have put my life
20 savings into building a nice , compatible , small hobby
21 farm just like all the other properties surrounding
22 this area .
23 I do not want what I deemed an asset to
24 Weld County destroyed by 4 , 000 cows 500 feet from my
25 home . And there were some more questions about the
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1 property if we had purchased it . I was involved in
2 that . We were simply intending to farm it and if we
3 could recoup our money in years to come , we would and
4 if we didn ' t recoup it , so be it . At least we would
5 have retained our quality of life .
6 That ' s it .
7 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Board have
8 any questions ? Please . Mike , go ahead .
9 COMMISSIONER GEILE : If I may , we ' ve heard
10 some theories of what an industrial dairy is , but
11 could you give me your definition of what a hobby
12 farm is .
13 MR . FRANK SEWALD : I just have a small
14 farm . I am retired and I raise alfalfa just -- and a
15 few animals . That , to me , is a hobby farm .
16 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Thank you .
17 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Commissioner , did
18 you have a question?
19 COMMISSIONER VAAD : Mr . Sewald , that was my
20 question , too . If I -- I don ' t want to put words in
21 your mouth . Would you say a hobby farm is not one
22 for the purpose of generating income , it ' s to sustain
23 a lifestyle that you --
24 MR . FRANK SEWALD : Yes .
25 COMMISSIONER VAAD : -- would rather have?
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1 MR . FRANK SEWALD : It gives me something
2 to do .
3 COMMISSIONER VAAD : Thank you .
4 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Thank you .
5 Next .
6 MR . LYNN RUSSELL : Lynn Russell , 41695
7 Weld County Road 15 .
8 Just about everything has been said that I
9 was going to say . When they were talking about this
10 dirt and all this dust , we lost two horses to dust
11 on -- because of that dust on the county road . We
12 had a vet come out and he did an ecropsia and he
13 decided that was what the problem was .
14 And the other thing that I have a concern
15 is , is I understand there ' s a possibility that they
16 could use their siderow sprinkler to get rid of
17 the -- their lagoon waste and that would be right
18 across the road from where the -- my arena is for
19 riding horses and that ' s where my kids and my
20 grandkids train their show horses .
21 So I don ' t think that this special permit
22 is adequate for this area for the same reason as it
23 goes with the land , it don ' t go with the person . And
24 so I just ask your consideration to think about it .
25 Thank you .
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1 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Thank you .
2 Questions? All right , thank you .
3 Is there anyone else that would like to
4 come forward at this time?
5 MR . COAN : Good morning , my name is Brent
6 Coan , I ' m with Otis Coan & Stewart , 1812 56th Avenue
7 in Greeley , Colorado .
8 I was first introduced to this issue in
9 July when a group of the neighbors approached me with
10 concerns that they had heard the -- that the
11 applicant was , in fact , going to , or intended to ,
12 install a 4 , 000 head dairy .
13 My recommendation to the group was to
14 contact Mr . Dye , try to arrange a meeting and find
15 out exactly what the plan is .
16 We did that . We did that in July . And --
17 and met with Mr . Dye and Mr . Haren , Mrs . Dye , and
18 discussed several issues .
19 At that time , we were told that all he
20 intended to install was a thousand head dairy . In
21 fact , Royal Crest had a need for milk that another
22 thousand cows could produce , and that was the extent
23 of the -- the extent of his plans .
24 During that meeting , we did discuss various
25 options . They were quite limited , though . And we
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1 did discuss at that meeting the possibility of
2 purchasing the property from Mr . Dye in order to
3 prevent further development consistent with what he
4 had indicated .
5 We even discussed purchasing a -- if , in
6 fact , what he planned was a thousand head dairy , we
7 discussed purchasing a restrictive covenant that
8 would , in fact , limit the extent of the use of the
9 property to a thousand head .
10 That was -- that was shut down pretty much
11 immediately as not an option . But Mr . Dye did
12 indicate that he was willing to entertain an offer
13 for purchase of the property .
14 I guess before I go any further , I did
15 intend to tell you that today I ' m speaking on behalf
16 of Jeanette Sewald , Tracy Eichheim , Mary Weiss , and
17 Stacy Temples . They all live within , approximately ,
18 a half a mile -- in fact , two of them , I believe ,
19 live within a quarter of a mile of the proposed dairy
20 site .
21 So my comments today are on their behalf ,
22 but I have worked with various parties in the
23 neighborhood on different issues .
24 As I mentioned , a meeting in July was in my
25 office . We did leave the meeting with the idea that
209
1 we would propose a purchase of the property and ,
2 ultimately , in August of 2000 we presented an offer
3 to Mr . Dye through -- through my office .
4 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Do you -- I ' m sorry ,
5 did you have a question --
6 COMMISSIONER GEILE : You just --
7 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Sorry to interrupt
8 you .
9 COMMISSIONER GEILE : The four people you
10 just -- you just identified , you ' re representing them
11 in purchasing the property?
12 MR . COAN : No . I was representing --
13 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Would you kind of --
14 MR . COAN : -- seven different parties in
15 the purchase offer .
16 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Well , maybe we could
17 kind of get that straightened out . You originally
18 said you are representing four people now --
19 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Today .
20 MR . COAN : Today I ' m speaking on behalf of
21 those four people that I specifically referenced . I
22 wanted to make it clear , though , that I have worked
23 with various different parties in the neighborhood on
24 various different issues . I ' ve consulted with the
25 majority of the people in the neighborhood on
210
1 different issues . I worked with seven families that
2 put together the purchase offer .
3 COMMISSIONER GEILE : I just wanted to
4 establish who you were representing there .
5 MR . COAN : Thank you . Here ' s a copy of
6 the purchase offer that was made . Just so that it ' s
7 very clear in the record that , in fact , a -- an offer
8 was made and the context in which it was made .
9 You ' ll note that the last paragraph on
10 page 1 does reference a property that I was aware of
11 that was available . I had just noticed in an ad in
12 the -- in fact , in the Greeley Tribune . Not that
13 that particular property is the most appropriate
14 property for a dairy or would function appropriately
15 for Mr . Dye , my attempt was to indicate with a
16 million three he could go find an alternative
17 property that was a better site for his proposed
18 dairy .
19 I also have a sales brochure for the
20 property that ' s referenced in the letter .
21 COMMISSIONER GEILE : I have one other --
22 Mr . Coan , I want to make sure that it is appropriate
23 that you share this with us . If this was presented
24 to Mr . Dye as an offer , is it appropriate for you to
25 share offers that were accepted or not accepted?
211
1 MR . COAN : I think it ' s appropriate .
2 There ' s been -- there ' s been testimony --
3 COMMISSIONER GEILE : For the record , your
4 opinion is it ' s okay to share this with us -- this
5 offer with us?
6 MR . COAN : Sure . There ' s other testimony
7 in the record that that , in fact , is intended to
8 support .
9 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Okay . But you ' re
10 sharing an actual offer that was made to Mr . Dye with
11 this board , so you ' re actually making this public
12 information . I just want to make sure --
13 MR . COAN : That ' s correct .
14 COMMISSIONER GEILE : -- in your opinion
15 that ' s appropriate .
16 MR . COAN : That ' s appropriate from my
17 clients ' perspective .
18 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Okay .
19 MR . COAN : Okay . And there ' s been other
20 testimony already that discloses pretty much the
21 details of what ' s in the letter .
22 One thing I want to , though , clarify for
23 you as well , is that it took a lot of effort to put
24 together a group to make that offer . I made sure
25 that there weren ' t any conditions , for instance , no
212
1 need to acquire financing that might prohibit them
2 from acquiring the property as they had proposed .
3 And , in fact , the need to acquire financing
4 was not -- was not there . The parties had the money
5 and were willing to put it up to acquire the
6 property .
7 I submitted a letter to the planning
8 commission , and I ' m submitting a similar letter ,
9 although I did pare it down for you , to I think , 9
10 pages instead of 12 . And it does have a few
11 additional items of information in it .
12 I ' m going to try not to testify with any --
13 to any extent from that letter , but I want to make
14 sure that information is provided in the record .
15 One thing that -- as I started working on
16 this and took a look at this use , that I found to be
17 astounding is comparing the waste generation from
18 4 , 000 cows to the waste generation of the human
19 population .
20 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Could I just
21 interrupt you for a second . What do we need copied ,
22 though?
23 MR . MORRISON : The new letter .
24 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : A copy of the new
25 letter . I apologize .
213
1 MR . COAN : I apologize for that , too , I --
2 I usually do that . I forgot that there . . .
3 Both my letter to the planning commission
4 and this letter includes a statistic that took some
5 effort , but I was able to confirm , and that is that a
6 lactating dairy cow produces as much waste as 34
7 humans produce .
8 Now when you do the math and consider ,
9 then , how much waste 4 , 000 cows generates , they
10 generate the same as 136 , 000 human beings . And I
11 think you -- so you take the context of 4 , 000
12 animals -- 4 , 000 dairy cows , and think of it in terms
13 of the city being there , 136 , 000 humans generating
14 that waste , and controlling that waste with earthen
15 lagoons and intending to spread the liquid part of
16 the waste on the adjacent property , and I think it
17 brings a different context to what you visualize .
18 In fact , when you take into consideration
19 both dairies , 6 , 000 cows , we ' re talking about 204 , 000
20 human beings .
21 The letter does include some information
22 about the incompleteness of the application . And if
23 you have questions about that later , I ' d like to try
24 to address those .
2.5 There ' s guidance in the comprehensive plan
214
1 for you that I think is of utmost importance . It ' s
2 found on page 2-2 . And that ' s in the letter as well ,
3 but I ' ll read it to you .
4 Quote , It is important that Weld County
5 representatives and officials recognize their role in
6 reducing the conflicts between agricultural uses and
7 residential , commercial , and industrial uses .
8 We ' d submit to the county commissioners
9 that approving the USA for 4 , 000 cows does not reduce
10 the conflicts between agricultural and residential
11 uses . It , in fact , sets up a circumstance where
12 there will be more conflict -- at least potentially
13 more conflict between those uses than you ' ve had in
14 the past .
15 I think you ' ve heard testimony that the
16 majority of the people , if not all of them , that live
17 in the neighborhood , recognize and are willing to
18 accept the use by right which would allow 1100 cows
19 on the property . To allow an additional 2900 or
20 3 , 000 cows on the property , though , is where the
21 objection comes from and where the conflict comes in .
22 So I ' d ask you to keep in mind the guidance
23 that the comprehensive plan provides for you with
24 regard to your role in helping to reduce those
25 conflicts .
215
1 I want to turn , briefly , to the specific
2 site that the applicant has proposed his use . You ' ve
3 heard a lot of testimony about groundwater , you ' ve
4 heard testimony about leaking Cactus Hill Ditch and ,
5 in fact , you ' ve heard testimony that at different
6 times the leaking from the ditch -- or the leakage
7 from the ditch , in fact , surfaces in the fields below
8 the ditch .
9 I took the liberty of making a photocopy of
10 Dr . Kimberling ' s -- one of Dr . Kimberling ' s
11 photographs that he submitted . And the overhead is
12 not going to work well .
13 In this photograph --
14 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : How about you
15 identify which exhibit that is and which number of
16 photograph , because we have that in front of us .
17 MR . COAN : I don ' t believe he used it as an
18 exhibit . It may have been in that pack of
19 photographs that he submitted to you , but I don ' t
20 have a copy of those .
21 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . That was
22 Exhibit WW . I don ' t see it as a copy in here .
23 MR . COAN : This was in the file in the
24 clerk to the board ' s office and that ' s where I was
25 getting it from .
216
1 The point I want to show to you -- and this
2 is the copy that the overhead was made up , maybe I ' ll
3 submit it as an exhibit -- you ' ll note that the
4 applicant ' s proposal stops at this field line right
5 here .
6 The dairy , again , is set up on this area .
7 This field right here is , in fact , the composting or
8 manure storage area . Right below the Cactus Hill
9 Ditch -- this is the Cactus Hill Ditch -- right below
10 that is , in fact , an area that was too wet to
11 harvest .
12 You ' ll see in the photograph an area that
13 looks like weeds or something . Well , it looks --
14 what we believe it is is beans that could not be
15 harvested because the seepage from the ditch was so
16 extreme they couldn ' t even harvest the beans there .
17 The rest of the field is cleanly harvested .
18 I ' ll submit the photograph with the
19 aerial that the overhead was made from so that you
20 can see it better . You really can ' t see it ,
21 unfortunately , on the overhead . I do have another
22 overhead . Perhaps we can see it from that .
23 And you do see it in this overhead . If I
24 could point the commissioners to this area right
25 here . This is the area I was speaking about that is
217
1 a result of the leakage from the Cactus Hill Ditch .
2 You can clearly see that it couldn ' t be harvested ,
3 the rest of the field has been harvested , it was just
4 too wet .
5 There ' s a lot of seepage there and there ' s
6 testimony on the record that , in fact , water comes to
7 the surface in that field . That is directly under
8 this composting and manure storage area .
9 MR . MORRISON : For the record , the first
10 one you identified is triple B . The next one , triple
11 C .
12 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : I ' m sorry , C , did
13 you say?
14 MR . MORRISON : C as in cat .
15 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Thank you . Cow .
16 MR . COAN : I think this is a very important
17 issue . So I have one more overhead . Again , it ' s not
18 very visible but the photographs are better . I can
19 point the commissioners to this area right here to
20 show you that , in fact , that was an area that could
21 not be harvested this last fall .
22 COMMISSIONER GEILE : But if I may ,
23 Commissioner , I just want to make sure --
24 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Sure .
25 COMMISSIONER GEILE : As you ' re talking
218
1 about the ditch and the seepage from the ditch ,
2 that ' s your point that it ' s coming from the ditch .
3 MR . COAN : That ' s correct .
4 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Whose responsibility
5 is that? It certainly is not the only area where
6 there ' s seepage from the ditch . And it sounds to me
7 like the ditch is old and there ' s other issues with
8 the ditch .
9 But the problems with the ditch are going
10 to be there whether this is approved or not or
11 whether there ' s 1100 dairy cows or whether the -- the
12 seepage is seepage and it ' s coming out of the ditch
13 and somebody has the responsibility to fix the ditch .
14 MR . COAN : I agree . That problem ' s going
15 to exist unless that ditch is lined .
16 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Whose responsibility ,
17 in your legal opinion , would it be to line or fix the
18 ditch?
19 MR . COAN : The applicant ' s . I don ' t
20 believe the water company has an obligation --
21 water -- that ditch has been there for a very long
22 time . The water company has , in fact , established a
23 right by virtue of its continuous leakage to continue
24 to allow that leakage .
25 COMMISSIONER GEILE : But in your opinion ,
219
1 if the applicant were to fix the ditch would that fix
2 the seepage?
3 MR . COAN : If the applicant were to line
4 the ditch with concrete --
5 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Or line it , whatever .
6 MR . COAN : Yes , I think that ' s probably the
7 only way to fix that ditch .
8 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Thank you . I wanted
9 to make sure .
10 MR . COAN : You might also note mentally
11 that the applicant at the planning commission
12 indicated -- or his representative indicated that
13 they were willing to line the ditch with concrete .
14 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : What was that?
15 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : It sounded like a
16 bird .
17 MR . COAN : You ' ve heard testimony from a
$ lot of people and I -- I asked at least the majority
19 of the people that I ' ve been in contact with over
20 this project , to give me an indication of , you know ,
21 how long they ' ve been there , how much property they
22 own , what they do , and whether or not they have any
23 agricultural background with the intent of
24 understanding whether they have any understanding of
25 the agricultural uses that would be possible , any
220
1 understanding of the impacts from those agricultural
2 uses .
3 What I ' m submitting now is a chart with
4 that information that I think provides a summary for
5 you that you may be able to refer to when you ' re
6 thinking this through . I have it on a board as well ,
7 but I don ' t think it will be as visible for you as --
8 as this is , so I ' ll just go with this .
9 I want to bring your attention to the way
10 this is organized . It ' s organized by where they are
11 geographically in the neighborhood . For instance ,
12 the first group of people live on Weld County Road
13 15 , the next group is on Weld County road 17 , 84 , 86 ,
14 and so forth .
15 I wanted to provide this to you as a
16 summary , I think , as much as anything , of who you ' ve
17 heard from today . Keith and Wendy Mullins , for
18 instance , have lived in this neighborhood for 29
19 years . Lynn and Linda Russell for 29 years . Cleon
20 and Betty Kimberling for 32 years . Debbie Ray and
21 Jerry Sherman , who own the property east of the
22 Cactus Hill Ditch , have owned that property for four
23 generations . Mary Weiss , who is the person with the
24 health issues that was described to you by the prior
25 person -- prior speaker , her family ' s owned that
221
1 property for 68 years . She ' s lived there for over 50
2 years . Jim and Carolyn Clary , 22 years , and Evelyn
3 Clark for 35 years .
4 So , again , I wanted to try to summarize who
5 you heard from in opposition to this proposal .
6 You have heard quite a bit about -- well ,
7 from the proponents , I guess I might say , of the
8 application . You ' ve heard about Mr . Dye being a good
9 operator . I think you heard from his veterinarian
10 that Mr . Dye was very good when he receives a
11 recommendation , of complying with that
12 recommendation .
13 And so I took a look at , you know -- and
14 also some of the rationale for approving the USR that
15 I see is that there will be certain -- certain
16 requirements of the applicant that wouldn ' t otherwise
17 be there . There will be a fly control plan , an odor
18 control plan and those kinds of things .
19 So it ' s important to consider whether this
20 applicant is somebody that , in fact , will comply with
21 that stuff . Mr . Dye , at the planning commission and
22 in front of this board , indicated that in his 15
23 years , he ' s never had a complaint about his dairy
24 operation . I want to submit to the board a letter
25 from the Department of Health and Environment at
222
1 Larimer County that ' s signed by Dave McCloskey , the
2 environmental health specialist in that office , that
3 indicates there have been a few seasonal public
4 complaints about Mr . Dye ' s operation . And , in
5 particular , about the lagoons and overflowage from
6 those lagoons .
7 Next , I think it ' s important for you to
8 consider that in the referral from the Weld County
9 Building Inspections Department , it made it clear
10 that any activities on the property would necessitate
11 a building permit . And , in particular , it did
12 reference the need for an excavation permit .
13 When I became aware of the fact that
14 Mr . Dye has had quite a few tractors on the property ,
15 has , in fact , excavated most if not all of the
16 topsoil from the site , and created a berm on the
17 south side of the property , I inquired as to whether
18 or not he had a permit for that and he did not .
19 So what I ' m submitting now is , in fact , the
20 permit that he applied for after this was brought to
21 the attention of the building inspections department .
22 The next item for your consideration is
23 whether or not Mr . Dye , in fact , has complied with
24 CAFO regulations at his existing dairy . A lot of the
25 County ' s consideration and conditions of approval
223
1 relate to Mr . Dye complying with CAFO regulations at
2 the new site . Mr . Dye ' s current dairy , the Dyecrest
3 Dairy , was inspected in , I believe , October . And
4 what I ' ve submitted now is a follow-up letter to that
5 inspection . And it has some important information .
6 You need to remember that both in front of
7 the planning commission and in front of this board
8 Mr . Haren indicated that he ' s worked with Terry for
9 the last two years . In fact , worked with him when he
10 was with EnviroStock , and now with AgPro , as -- in
11 the capacity of managing his environmental
12 compliance .
13 On the second page of the letter that ' s
14 been submitted , it ' s a letter addressed to Mr . Dye ,
15 and it ' s signed by Ron Jepsen of the Water Quality
16 Control Division . On the second page , second full
17 paragraph , the last sentence indicates -- and I ' ll
18 read it into the record -- Tier 2 requires that the
19 operator shall maintain copies of the agronomic
20 analysis which are being relied upon for the purpose
21 of limiting land application rates of manure and
22 processed wastewater . Copies of such analysis shall
23 be available for inspection at the facility and
24 records shall be maintained for a minimum of three
25 years . End quote .
224
1 Mr . Jepsen then finds , During our visit ,
2 the dairy did not have records of agronomic analysis
3 that were being relied upon for the purpose of
4 limiting land application rates of manure and
5 processed wastewater .
6 Even though the CAFO regulations require
7 that , he did not have the analysis , any records of
8 the analysis -- and I think that probably indicates
9 that he didn ' t have the analysis done . It ' s a
10 simple -- it ' s a simple task to keep the records if
11 you do the analysis . So there ' s one issue where he
12 hasn ' t complied with CAFO .
13 I would also like to then turn you to the
14 proposed site where he has 75 acres of cropland
15 within which to manage all of the nutrients that come
16 from the waste from 4 , 000 cows . That ' s significantly
17 less , I think , than the majority of the dairy
18 operations that are out there . It ' s significantly
19 less than you should be willing to accept .
20 I ' d like to use as an example the Morwai
21 Dairy . And I got these statistics from the County ' s
22 files , and from a letter from Mr . Haren to
23 Mr . Jiricek .
24 The Morwai Dairy , which is approaching the
25 4 , 000 head dairy as of this fall -- or approaching
225
1 4 , 000 head operation level as of this fall , has 560
2 acres presently being used in his nutrient management
3 plan . It has an additional 2 , 080 acres available if
4 needed .
5 So take those as comparisons . 75 acres
6 versus 560 acres presently , and an additional 2 , 000
7 acres available , if needed . I ' d submit that 75 acres
8 is absolutely unacceptable and not enough to manage
9 all of the nutrients from this .
10 The other issue I want to bring to your
11 attention with regard to the -- Mr . Jepsen ' s letter ,
12 I ' ll do with an overhead . I said overhead , I meant
13 aerial photograph .
14 You ' ll note in the first full paragraph on
15 page 2 of Mr . Jepsen ' s letter , Mr . Jepsen describes
16 one of the complaints he received related to concern
17 about the composting site and some of the pens not
18 draining to an impoundment or detention -- retention
19 pond . He indicates that he observed , however , that
20 the stormwater from the composting site in calf
21 hutches located at the north end of the dairy pens
22 and milking barns contained a long berm . The next
23 sentence is what ' s critical here .
24 The berm and catchman area have been in
25 place since before 1992 , thereby exempting this
226
1 impoundment area from being lined in accordance with
2 Section 81 . 4 ( a ) , per Section 81 . 4 ( c ) . 81 . 4 ( c ) of the
3 CAFO regulations indicates when you have an
4 impoundment area or retention pond that was in place
5 and utilized before August of 1992 you ' re not
6 required to line that facility . That ' s why they
7 indicated it was in place before 1992 .
8 What I ' ve displayed as an aerial
9 photograph here is an aerial photograph of the area
10 that was certified by the United States Department of
11 Agriculture Farm Service Agency as having been flown
12 in the year 1993 . The certification letter is now
13 being passed around to the commissioners .
14 You ' ll note that it references map
15 6670-150L . That ' s the number on this aerial
16 photograph right here . And I know it ' s difficult ,
17 from your distance , to see this aerial photograph .
18 And I ' d be glad to bring it forward if you need me
19 to , to see it better .
20 This is an aerial photograph of , in fact ,
21 the area . This is the proposed dairy site over here ,
22 this is the existing dairy right here . This is a
23 1993 photograph , and it does not show the impoundment
24 area at all . It does not show the composting and
25 manure storage area at all .
227
1 So as of 1993 when this aerial photograph
2 was taken , there was not a manure storage composting
3 area and retention lagoon for that area as there is
4 today , and as Mr . Jepsen witnessed when he visited
5 the property .
6 The other aerial photograph I have here is
7 taken in 1999 . And it shows clearly the manure
8 composting area . And this black area here is the
9 lagoon or retention area that Mr . Jepsen viewed and
10 referenced in his letter . It ' s important to take
11 into consideration the size of that lagoon , or
12 retention area , with his other lagoons that are in
13 place to handle 2 , 000 cows . I have reduced copies --
14 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : I ' m sorry , just a
15 second . Comment .
16 MR . MORRISON : Okay . So I ' m clear , you
17 have certification for the 1993 map?
18 MR . COAN : That ' s correct .
19 MR . MORRISON : Do you have certification
20 for the later map?
21 MR . COAN : I do not have certification for
22 that , but it ' s -- but it is -- you know , it shows
23 what ' s out there today . I believe I have other
24 aerial photographs of this site as well , if you ' d
25 prefer seeing that .
228
1 I cannot certify that this is a 1999 map by
2 tendering a letter from the USDA , but I can tell you
3 that what was ordered -- what was available and what
4 was ordered was a 1999 map and that ' s what was
5 provided by the USDA .
6 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Is that acceptable ,
7 Mr . Morrison?
8 MR . MORRISON : Well , I -- it goes to the
9 weight of the evidence . Mostly I want -- I ' m going
10 to attach the ' 93 certification to the map as one
11 exhibit , that ' s Exhibit III .
12 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay .
13 MR . MORRISON : And then J will be the 1999
14 map .
15 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Thank you .
16 MR . COAN : I would be glad to submit a
17 reduced version of just the 1993 map if that would
18 aid you in reviewing my testimony and the information
19 I ' ve provided .
20 And I understand Mr . Morrison ' s concern .
21 What we have is the photograph -- a photocopy of a
22 portion of an exhibit which would need to be a
23 different exhibit -- I ' d leave it up to you . I would
24 encourage you to confirm what I ' ve told you by
25 looking at the exhibit closer if you need to , if the
229
1 distance is too far to look at it , but I do have the
2 other photocopies if you want it .
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Does the board need
4 to receive -- members of the board need to see
5 photocopies? Do you wish to see those?
6 No . Thank you . I ' m sorry . Did you
7 have --
8 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Before we leave this
9 whole area of discussion , I would like to have a
10 clarification of what you ' re asserting . I understand
11 you ' re asserting that something was not there in
12 ' 93 .
13 MR . COAN : Yes .
14 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : And from this
15 letter -- maybe I misunderstood you -- this letter
16 says it is there now , but did this letter from the --
17 the one from the state you ' re referencing , did it say
18 it was there in ' 92?
19 MR . COAN : The letter --
20 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Is that what you ' re
21 saying?
22 MR . COAN : The letter indicates that he
23 viewed a -- he saw a third retention area , or
24 impoundment , I guess he called it , where the
25 composting site and some pens drained to . He said
230
1 that stormwater from the composting site and calf
2 hutches located in the north end of the dairy pens
3 and milking barn is contained by a long berm .
4 He then indicates that he was told that the
5 berm and catchman area have been in place since 1992 ,
6 thereby exempting this impoundment area from being
7 lined in accordance with subsection 81 ( a ) 4 -- I ' m
8 sorry , 81 . 4 ( a ) , per subsection 81 . 4 ( c . ) .
9 And he goes on to say that , in fact , the
10 berm has been increased to contain --
11 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Okay . I guess you
12 answered my question . I wanted to nail down whether
13 you were saying that someone from the State said it
14 or the State said that he was told that . You ' re
15 saying the State ' s --
16 MR . COAN : You know , I think you have to
17 read into the letter that he was told that . And I ' ve
18 talked to Mr . Jepsen and that ' s , in fact , what he --
19 what he indicated to me is that he was told the
20 impoundment area had been there since 1992 . He would
21 have no -- no personal knowledge to draw that
22 conclusion .
23 So the point I ' m getting to is Mr . Dye ' s
24 not only not in compliance with CAFO by virtue of not
25 keeping agronomic analysis and I think likely not
231
1 doing agronomic analysis , he ' s also in violation for
2 having a third impoundment area that ' s not lined .
3 They dealt with the inspection by
4 indicating it had been there prior to 1992 and the
5 aerial photograph is evidence that it wasn ' t there
6 prior to 1992 .
7 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . I ' m sorry we
8 all keep interrupting , but I hope you don ' t mind
9 because while you ' re on the subject I would like to
10 ask you a question as well .
11 MR . COAN : Please .
12 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : I ' m looking at the
13 letter that you ' re talking about , I assume , dated
14 November 29th , 2000 . And when you say he ' s not in
15 compliance with CAFO regulations , are you
16 specifically talking about regulation No . 81 ?
17 MR . COAN : Yes .
18 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Well , then , I
19 would like to just read this to you from your own --
20 the letter that you submitted as an exhibit . It ' s on
21 page 2 , paragraph 6 .
22 In summary -- and this is from this Ron
23 Jepsen , who is the water quality control division --
24 In summary , the Dyecrest Dairy was in compliance with
25 regulation No . 81 on October 30th , 2000 .
232
1 MR . COAN : And it goes on to say , except
2 for --
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Except for , but it
4 does say that it ' s in compliance . And then it does
5 say , you ' re right , to please submit those things in
6 the future .
7 So at this point , it appears from the
8 letter that you submitted to us from the water
9 quality control division , Ron Jepsen , dated
10 November 29th , that they are stating that the dairy
11 is in compliance .
12 MR . COAN : And I ' ll be clarifying that with
13 Mr . Jepsen with these aerial photographs . What
14 Mr . Jepsen was told is that that impoundment area had
15 been there prior to 1992 , and that ' s an error in he ' d
16 been told and an error in his conclusions based on an
17 assumption or information that was incorrect .
18 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Do you have
19 any further documentation from Mr . Jepsen about
20 that?
21 MR . COAN : I do not .
22 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : You do not?
23 Does Mr . --
24 MR . COAN : But I will because I will be
25 providing the aerial photograph to him as evidence
233
1 that , in fact , the impoundment area was not there in
2 1992 .
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Is Mr . Jepsen here
4 today?
5 MR . COAN : No .
6 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Oh , okay . Thank
7 you .
8 MR . COAN : Not to my knowledge .
9 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : All right . Thank
10 you .
11 MR . COAN : So I think it ' s important for
12 the board to consider whether Mr . Dye has -- if
13 you ' re going to rely on conditions of approval and
14 his compliance with those conditions , has he complied
15 with his obligations in the past? He ' s had some
16 complaints , he ' s indicated he hasn ' t . He didn ' t get
17 an excavating permit when he needed to , not until the
18 County was made aware of it .
19 We submit evidence that he wasn ' t in
20 compliance on the agronomic analysis and records ,
21 even though he ' s had a consultant working with him
22 for two years . And we submit evidence that , in fact ,
23 the impoundment area -- the third impoundment area is
24 not in compliance with the CAFO regulations either .
25 As Mr . Mullins indicated earlier , I think
234
1 there was quite valuable discussion last Wednesday
2 when you denied a PUD , or minor subdivision , I ' m not
3 sure what it was , based on its -- the residential
4 uses not being compatible with a feedlot that was in
5 close proximity .
6 I think it ' s important to think back to
7 your discussions about that particular project that
8 was proposed and consider , here there are 25
9 residences within a half a mile of this proposed use ;
10 50 residences within a mile . In fact , again , because
11 I ' ve -- I ' m concerned it ' s difficult for you to
12 see dots that are on large maps , I ' ll submit one more
13 exhibit for you to take a look at .
14 This exhibit was -- I made , myself , from
15 viewing the aerial photographs of the area . The
16 first page of this exhibit came from the applicant ' s
17 application and it ' s his vicinity map . The vicinity
18 map , my recollection , is supposed to show all
19 residences within a half a mile of the proposed use .
20 So you can see what , in fact , he did submit as being
21 within a half a mile .
22 The second page , then , is my effort to
23 bring the aerial photograph down to this scale so
24 that you can see the residences that are in close
25 proximity to the proposed use . I did some cutting
235
1 and pasting and was able to get the prior -- I ' m
2 sorry , the proposed dairy layout pasted in there so
3 you can see how it ' s situated .
4 Again , Mr . Mullins indicated , in fact , it ' s
5 a little bit different . The whole thing is shifted a
6 little bit to the north . And I apologize for the
7 amateurish drawing of the existing Dyecrest Dairy ,
8 which you ' ve seen my drawings before and I do my
9 best .
10 The green are the existing residences in
11 the area . The red dots are future residences . I
12 want to be clear , though , when I say that the -- the
13 stuff in Section 7 -- the red dots in Section 7 ,
14 those are approved right now . The red dots in
15 Section 8 are the change of zone stated in the city
16 division process . The red dots towards the top of
17 the map relate to a 200-acre parcel that ' s under --
18 under contract with a developer and the intent is to
19 build very nice residences there .
20 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : So those are
21 proposed?
22 MR . COAN : Those are -- those are proposed .
23 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Actually , there
24 isn ' t anything proposed , it ' s just up for sale .
25 MR . COAN : Yeah , right . But that is the
236
1 purchaser ' s plan for the property upon acquisition of
2 the property .
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . But the
4 property hasn ' t been purchased by anyone as of yet?
5 MR . COAN : They have not closed yet .
6 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Thank you .
7 MR . COAN : In fact , one of the delays in
8 closing is what happens here .
9 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Can I ask a
10 question?
11 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Sure .
12 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : The green dots are
13 inhabited houses or are some of these not?
14 MR . COAN : I believe they are all inhabited
15 except the -- if you take a look at the dairy site
16 and look immediately east of the dairy site on
17 Weld County Road 84 and north of the road , I believe
18 that site is not habited -- or inhabited .
19 I ' m probably not the best person to answer
20 that , but I have visited about this issue pretty
21 extensively and I can tell you that a lot of the
22 people you ' ve heard from live in these houses .
23 It ' s important to recognize that it -- in
24 the list of people that I gave you , there are 23
25 residences , there ' s room for 10 more without any
237
1 further zoning or subdivision approval . Also --
2 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Mr . Coan , can I ask
3 you just a real quick question?
4 MR . COAN : Yes .
5 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : It ' s almost noon .
_ 6 Do you have quite a bit more testimony --
7 MR . COAN : I don ' t .
8 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . But I ' m going
9 to assume that the board has some questions of you ,
10 at least I know one of us does .
11 MR . COAN : Okay .
12 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : So at this time ,
13 I -- and , again , I apologize for interrupting you ,
14 but I am going to --
15 MR . COAN : That ' s fine .
16 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : -- recess the
17 hearing . And when we come back at 1 : 30 , we ' ll make
18 sure that you get up first so you can finish your
19 statements .
20 MR . COAN : Okay .
21 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : And then the board
22 will have the opportunity to ask you questions .
23 MR . COAN : Thank you .
24 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : So we will be
25 recessing until 1 : 30 .
238
1 ( Recess taken at 11 : 58 a . m . to 1 : 35 p . m . )
2 AFTERNOON SESSION
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : All right . I ' ll
4 reconvene the Board of County Commissioners hearing .
5 And we were right in the middle of Mr . Coan ' s
6 testimony . So we ' re -- and we ' re in the middle of
7 the public hearing .
8 So Mr . Coan , would you like to go ahead and
9 finish up your comments ?
10 MR . COAN : Thank you . Over lunch I had an
11 opportunity to clarify one of the questions I believe
12 Commissioner Geile asked , whether all of these green
13 dots represent occupied residences --
14 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Commissioner Baxter .
15 MR . COAN : Commissioner Baxter , I ' m sorry .
16 Thank you .
17 I want to clarify , I indicated that the
- 18 green dot , or the residence immediately east of the
19 proposed dairy on the north side of the road is not
20 occupied . In fact , that is occupied part of the
21 year . The family that owns that property uses it in
22 the summertime and on the weekends . And so that --
23 that property is , in fact , occupied as well , at least
24 part of the year . And all summer long . So I wanted
25 to clarify that .
239
1 So this -- this exhibit -- and I don ' t know
2 what it ' s marked -- but the exhibit with the green
3 dots and the red dots is intended to represent ,
4 obviously , existing conditions at the property . The
5 red indicates the future to a certain extent .
6 You have a letter in your file from
7 Evelyn -- Evelyn Clark that described a 150-lot
8 subdivision . That sketch plan had been submitted in
9 Section 7 , which is the section immediately to the
10 south and west of the proposed site .
11 In fact , I did get a copy of the sketch
12 plan from the planning department and -- and one has
13 been submitted . It ' s 153 lots . It extends from just
14 below the -- the red dots on the map on down past
15 Highway 14 .
16 I tried to contact the applicant to discuss
17 exactly what ' s going on with that proposal and was
18 unsuccessful , before the hearing today , to contact
19 him . I did find out from -- go ahead .
20 COMMISSIONER VAAD : Would you point that
21 out ? That wasn ' t turned on when you were talking --
22 MR . COAN : Okay . Sure . Section 7 is this
23 section right here . And the red dots on the exhibit
24 that you have in front of you that I made are about
25 in the middle of the section . So about midsection
240
_ 1 going south into this quarter here , I believe the
2 north half of that quarter . There ' s a 153-unit
3 sketch plan that has been submitted . I have a copy
4 of it somewhere , but I don ' t think that ' s -- that ' s
5 necessary .
6 But I do want to indicate to you that
7 Julie , I guess , has worked on that project and she ' s
8 indicated that , to a certain extent , this was the
9 property owner ' s effort to comply with everybody ' s
10 fears related to Amendment 24 .
11 And there are some problems with developing
12 the property to the scale that ' s been proposed . One
13 being sewer availability . So this may not be a
14 project that moves forward in the next three to five
15 years , according to Julie .
16 So you -- I want to make sure you ' re aware
17 of that . But the reference in the letter to a
18 150-lot subdivision beginning in that area is , in
19 fact , true , a sketch plan has been submitted. So
20 that gives you a picture of what the future , to a
21 certain extent , is as well .
22 If you look to the west of the subject
23 property , three and one-half miles to the west is , in
24 fact , the existing city limits of Fort Collins . It ' s
25 not the urban growth boundary , it ' s , in fact , the
241
1 existing city limits .
2 The existing city limits are on the east
3 side of 1-25 directly west of the proposed site and
4 the existing dairy . So it does give you another
5 perspective , as well as Severance right here on the
6 overhead .
7 I went in a completely different order than
8 I had intended to when I started my presentation and
9 I ' m not sure if I addressed the water issue . I don ' t
10 think I did . But Commissioner Geile , you had some --
11 some questions for the applicant about my math and I
12 wanted to try to clarify that for you .
13 Again , I don ' t know what exhibit number the
14 letter from the water district is , but if you can
15 locate that in your packet , I want to explain why I
16 think that the evidence of water availability doesn ' t
17 meet the criteria set forth in your zoning ordinance .
18 The center of that letter contains a table
19 that indicates what the tap fees are . At a minimum
20 with this water district you have to dedicate
21 1 acre-foot of water . And that ' s identified in the
22 left-hand column under tap fees as $ 14 , 000 . The rest
23 of that column adds in additional tap fees for a
24 total of $ 422 , 000 in just tap fees .
25 The right-hand column in that chart also
242
1 indicates what additional infrastructure will be
2 necessary in order to supply 80 gallons a minute to
3 the applicant ' s site . And if you -- and there ' s a
4 range of costs there .
5 The applicant ' s representative indicated
6 that he believes the water costs are going to be
7 about $ 400 , 000 . I don ' t understand that math when ,
8 in fact , just tap fees and infrastructure are going
9 to be 455 to 65 thousand dollars .
10 My concern about the evidence that ' s been
11 provided by the applicant is this -- and one of my
12 clients did check with the water district . They ' ve
13 not had additional contact by the applicant since
14 they issued this letter .
15 The water district has indicated that --
16 and typical of municipalities and water districts ,
17 they give you credit for each -- they give you credit
18 in raw water dedication of 228 , 000 gallons for each
19 acre-foot , or acre unit they call it here , that ' s
20 dedicated .
21 They give you the option of dedicating
your
22 own water or you can actually purchase the raw water
23 requirements from the district . The district has a
24 price of $ 14 , 000 per acre-foot . And that ' s pretty
25 comparable , I think , right now to CBT water . And I
243
1 think that ' s where they derive their price .
2 If you look at the last paragraph in that
3 letter from the water district , it indicates that the
4 applicant has requested 42 , 076 , 800 gallons on an
5 annualized basis of water service . If you then
6 divide that number by 228 , 000 gallons for each
7 acre-foot that you would get credit for , that
8 indicates you would have to dedicate 184 . 55 acre-feet
9 of water in order to guarantee that water service
10 will be available .
11 If you then multiply that by the $ 14 , 000
12 per acre foot , you come up with the 2 . 5 -- little
13 more than $ 2 . 5 million just in raw water
14 requirements .
15 The district does give a user like this the
16 opportunity to rent water instead of dedicating all
17 of that water . That ' s a tremendous burden . Again ,
18 the problem with that is that Section 2 point -- or
19 24 . 5 . 1 . 1 says that the -- and by the way , the
20 applicant has the burden of proof under your
21 ordinance -- the applicant has to provide evidence of
22 adequate water service in terms of quality , quantity ,
23 and dependability is available to the site to serve
24 the uses permitted .
25 You ' ll note that the water district also
244
1 indicates that if he chooses to rent water and
2 dedicate the rented water on an annualized basis ,
3 there ' s no guarantee that he ' ll get water service
4 from the district . Rented water from the district is
5 on a first-come-first-serve basis .
6 And there ' s some testimony on the record
7 that , in fact , this last year , in a somewhat dry
8 year , the people in this area had a hard time renting
9 water to supplement the water that they own .
10 So I would -- I put before the commission
11 not only the tremendous cost to actually acquire
12 treated water for a dairy use , but I ' d submit that
13 what the district has indicated is that unless he
14 purchases the water and dedicates it , he hasn ' t met
15 the dependability criteria under your ordinance .
16 So I hope the math that I ' ve provided to
17 you makes sense and you understand how I calculated
18 that .
19 And then , briefly , I wanted to provide --
20 or bring to the commissioners attention an
21 agricultural and resource policy report issued by the
22 Colorado State University in February of 1999 . I can
23 never say this gentleman ' s name but Andrew Seido ,
24 S E I D 0 , and Jessica Davis edited it , and there are
25 about eight different authors for the different
245
1 sections .
2 One of the sections in this document
3 relates to site selection for confined animal
4 operations . And I think there ' s some important stuff
5 in here for you to consider .
6 The first statement in the site selection
7 section says , Problems with neighbors can be avoided
8 if livestock operations are located far away , or in
9 places where the odors will not be carried to
10 locations where they are objectionable . That ' s a
11 pretty plain fact . Locate them away from residences
12 and there won ' t be problems .
13 The very next paragraph , first sentence
14 says , Avoid siting near residential , commercial or
15 recreational areas . It says , For operations of less
16 than 1 , 000 animal units , a quarter of a mile is
17 usually adequate separation distance . Larger
18 operations required a half a mile in many cases .
19 It also says , Where a growing community is
20 nearby , a distance of two to three miles is
21 necessary .
22 The next paragraph , Odors will often move
23 downhill , especially in the evening when air is
24 cooling .
25 And you ' ll note that this -- the
246
1 applicant ' s proposal is for a site that ' s on a
2 hillside . The ditch is the highest point and the
3 residences are , in fact , downhill from the site .
4 Next sentence in that
paragraph , Hilltops
5 are good choices when there are no sensitive areas
6 below .
7 In this case , we have a hilltop site and we
8 have sensitive areas below . We have residential
9 uses .
10 In fact , it says , Avoid hilltops where
11 developments are downhill . If this is unavoidable ,
12 increase the distance between the facilities and the
13 sensitive areas .
14 I know the County ' s looked at some odor
15 control issues and the finding in this report that
16 proper siting is the most economical control
17 mechanism available to you . Proper siting or
18 changing the siting of an existing dairy is not , but
19 proper siting of a new dairy is .
20 Before I take
your questions , I want to
21 bring your attention to findings of this board in
22 February of 1999 when the board declined to allow a
23 USR for an expanded dairy operation for the Scott
24 Buskirk Dairy . This was for an expansion from
25 approximately 800 , 850 animal units , or animals , I
247
1 should say , to 3500 dairy cows -- or 3500 cattle .
2 In finding 1 -A , the Board of County
3 Commissioners found that the uses which would be
4 permitted would not be compatible with the existing
5 surrounding land uses . The finding specifically
6 says , These uses include rural residential
7 subdivisions , which are not compatible with expansion
8 of a dairy to the proposed size , 3500 cows .
9 My recollection of that proposal was that
10 there were 14 to 15 homes in fairly close proximity
11 to -- to the proposed site . Maybe at the upward , 17
12 homes , but I recall specifically there were less than
13 20 . And they weren ' t all within a half a mile .
14 In this case , we have 25 homes within a
15 half a mile of the proposed site and 50 within a
16 mile .
17 Finding 1 -C , which calls for the
18 commissioners to find that there was adequate
19 provision for the protection of the health , safety
20 and welfare of the inhabitants of the neighborhood
21 and the county , the board of county commissioners
22 finds that the applicant does not appear to currently
23 be in compliance , nor has he demonstrated his ability
24 to comply in the future with conditions of approval
25 and development standards necessary for the
248
1 protection of the health , safety and welfare of the
2 inhabitants in terms of the proposed use by special
3 review .
4 The other thing I recall about that
5 proposal is -- and I can ' t cite specific numbers --
6 but I think I can comfortably say that there was more
7 acreage , in fact , available for the nutrient
8 management plan than there is for this particular
9 project as well .
10 So I think there ' s precedence for the
11 commissioners to find that compatibility with
12 existing surrounding land uses at this site -- or
13 that there is not compatibility with the existing
14 surrounding land uses .
15 Again , your -
- your zoning ordinance ,
16 24 . 4 . 2 , the last sentence , indicates that the
17 applicant has the burden of proof to show that the
18 standards and conditions of the various sections are
19 met . So the applicant has the burden of proof under
20 USR to prove to you that his proposed use at the size
21 he ' s proposed is consistent with all of the criteria
22 that ' s set forth in the ordinance .
23 Before I take questions , I want to submit
24 one last document to the board . My clients asked me
25 to submit some mitigation measures for your
249
1 consideration . They asked me to make sure that you
2 understand that their proposal of certain mitigation
3 measures do not indicate that they think if these
4 mitigation measures are included in an approval
5 document it takes care of all their concerns . It
6 doesn ' t . They still don ' t believe it ' s compatible ,
7 they still don ' t think this is an appropriate site
8 for this proposal . But if you decide to approve it ,
9 please consider these additional mitigation measures .
10 I did not write these , my clients submitted
11 them to me . I ' ve briefly reviewed them . If you have
12 questions about them , I can try to answer them .
13 My letter contains in the conclusion , I
14 think , several points of -- several points for you to
15 consider in denying this application . And on behalf
16 of my clients , we do request that you deny the
17 application .
18 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Finished?
19 MR . COAN : Any questions ?
20 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : You ready for
21 questions ? All right , Commissioner .
22 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Maybe we can start on
23 the application that you were referring to that -- in
24 February of 1999 . There were certain operational
25 issues with that operator . I ' m sure you noticed that
250
1 when you looked at the findings , which are different
2 in this case because there doesn ' t seem to be the
3 same operational issues with Mr . Dye .
4 The other one was it was in the urban
5 growth boundary of the --
6 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Firestone .
7 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Firestone . So that is
8 another different issue . This is outside of any
9 urban growth area , but I just wanted to make sure ,
10 did you see that when you looked at the findings ?
11 MR . COAN : I agree 100 percent it was -- it
12 was actually half of it was within the Firestone
13 urban growth boundary area , so it was a real unique
14 property .
15 The property was within the boundary , half
16 of it wasn ' t . I don ' t recall what operational issues
17 you may be referring to . There ' s no reference in the
18 resolution to those operational issues unless you ' re
19 referring to that applicant not being in compliance
20 with confined animal feeding operations as well .
21 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : I ' m not sure , " as
22 well " is in there . But yes , in the Buskirk -- in the
23 denial of the Buskirk expansion , it was that he
24 wasn ' t in compliance with CAFO operations ; in fact ,
25 he stated at the microphone he wasn ' t even aware of
251
1 all the CAFO regulations . And also it had to do with
2 some of his ponds that weren ' t lined that needed to
3 be lined . So that ' s what that was about .
4 COMMISSIONER GEILE : But I did have a
5 couple of other questions , if I may --
6 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Sure .
7 COMMISSIONER GEILE : -- Madam Chairman .
8 The Department of Health and Environment ,
9 their letter dated December 7 , 2000 from
10 Mr . McCloskey , that is -- if this is the way they
11 practice environmental science over in Larimer
12 County , don ' t you have some real questions about this
13 letter?
14 My question is : They don ' t maintain any
15 records when complaints are received? They send them
16 in to the State and still don ' t have any records ,
17 don ' t have any follow-up records ?
18 So , you know , as far as this exhibit
19 showing any precedence with me , Counsel , I -- I ' m not
20 sure what -- what this gives me other than to say
21 very , very flimsy methodologies of doing
22 environmental science in Larimer County .
23 MR . COAN : Larimer County takes a position
24 that supervision and review of this type of use is a
25 State ' s purview and they don ' t do anything but act as
252
1 a conduit to refer complaints to the State . What I
2 found more distressing , Commissioner , is when I
3 contacted the State for record of complaints since
4 CAFO regulations were implemented , I received a
5 spreadsheet that went back to April of 1999 and no
6 farther . That was the extent of their records .
7 And it was blamed on the retirement of the
8 prior supervisor of CAFOs . But , unfortunately ,
9 that ' s -- like I say , that ' s even more distressing
10 when counties believe that the State is regulating
11 and reviewing and inspecting and keeping proper
12 records , it ' s distressing to find out that , in fact ,
13 they go back to April of 1999 and no records prior to
14 that . And there ' s nothing more than a list that ' s on
15 a Lotus spreadsheet .
16 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Fourth question ,
17 please .
18 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : I guess in reference
19 to the letter , though , I would point out the last
20 sentence in the first paragraph , which does state
21 that Larimer County did investigate this year ' s
22 complaint and did not verify a problem with the
23 lagoons . So maybe that ' s part of the reason why they
24 didn ' t feel a need for follow-up .
25 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Maybe it is .
253
1 MR . COAN : Well , and I agree that it ' s your
2 perview to give any evidence or any documents that I
3 give you certain weight . And if you believe that ' s
4 not , you know , a weighted bit of evidence I can
5 appreciate that , but I think it ' s important for you
6 to know that Larimer County has received complaints
7 about the existing operation .
8 COMMISSIONER GEILE : Here ' s the last
9 question is : The current dairy is within -- is
10 within 3 miles of the city limits of Fort Collins .
11 This one is -- because it would be based on what I ' ve
12 heard , be -- this dairy would be 3-1 / 2 miles away .
13 MR . COAN : Correct .
14 COMMISSIONER GEILE : So the other dairy
15 would be 2-1 / 2 miles away .
16 MR . COAN : Correct .
17 COMMISSIONER GEILE : And so it ' s within
18 2-1 / 2 miles , so it would be within the 3-mile
19 referral .
20 MR . COAN : The existing dairy would be
21 within the --
22 COMMISSIONER GEILE : But this one is not .
23 But you mentioned something about Fort Collins . Is
24 there -- are you referencing some kind of a plan by
25 Fort Collins to come out here and annex this area or
254
1 what was the --
2 MR . COAN : I ' m not aware of any . It was to
3 try to give you a bigger context within which to view
4 this property .
5 COMMISSIONER GEILE : But the fact of it
6 is , it ' s not within anybody ' s urban growth -- I mean ,
7 with any -- within the 3-mile radius that we need to
8 consider .
9 MR . COAN : It ' s not within the 3-mile
10 radius and --
11 COMMISSIONER GEILE : For any projection --
12 MR . COAN : -- and Fort Collins has not
13 updated its urban growth boundary in that area since
14 1980 , is the information I was provided . They ' ve , in
15 fact , annexed out to their urban growth boundary line
16 in that area .
17 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : But since 1980 ,
18 Fort Collins has updated their comprehensive land use
19 plan and their master plan .
20 MR . COAN : I suspect so , yes .
21 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : In fact , within the
22 last five years , Fort Collins has updated their
23 comprehensive plan so maybe they don ' t feel like
24 urban growth is going that way so that ' s why they
25 haven ' t revised that line in that direction .
255
1 MR . COAN : That could be . I don ' t know . I
2 can ' t testify to that .
3 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : But currently it
4 isn ' t any municipality ' s urban growth boundary area?
5 MR . COAN : No , it is not .
6 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Thank you .
7 Any questions? Any further questions ?
8 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Follow up on that one
9 question .
10 I don ' t remember you saying for sure . This
11 letter states that they did turn it over to the
12 State , a complaint , in the spring of ' 99 . On the
13 spreadsheet you said you had , was there a record on
14 it of a complaint being followed up on or even being
15 registered during that time?
16 MR . COAN : No , there was not .
17 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Other
18 questions ?
19 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : I ' ve got a couple
20 other questions .
21 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Sure .
22 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Well , yeah , most of
23 these are follow-up to the applicant . But the
24 ditch -- and the ditch road -- maybe it ' s a moot
25 point because from the photographs it indicates there
256
1 was seepage .
2 But , to your knowledge , I ' m wondering if
3 you know -- in fact , Monday afternoon I went up and
4 drove this whole area and I drove back on that ditch
5 road for quite a ways and on the downhill side of
6 that ditch on that ditch road , the ditch road is
7 almost like a dam there . I mean it ' s a wide area .
8 So I assume that that follows the whole
9 ditch . I don ' t know , but I mean , your contention
10 must be -- or do you know , is all this seepage coming
11 out not only from the ditch but underneath this whole
12 embankment which is like a dam? Does it come under
13 all that?
14 MR . COAN : Yes . And certainly my only
15 knowledge of that is from talking to the folks who
16 live in the neighborhood . In fact , I -- if it wasn ' t
17 here , it was in front of the planning commission , the
18 people that use that ditch have tried numerous things
19 in the past to try to seal it for various reasons .
20 One is the seepage into that field .
21 They ' ve tried lining it with plastic and they ' ve
22 reported to me that you can still see some of the
23 plastic in the ditch from that attempt . But it ' s --
24 it appears to be common knowledge in the neighborhood
25 that the ditch leaks excessively and they ' ve tried
257
1 to -- they ' ve tried to change that and modify it in
2 the past .
3 I think another -- another possible way
4 that there ' s a recharge of the groundwater and a
5 seepage into the fields where the applicant ' s
6 proposing this use is rainfall as well on the east
7 side of the ditch . There ' s a little trough area --
8 if you have aerial photographs that show it , there ' s
9 a little trough area on the east side of the ditch .
10 There ' s a little -- an additional little rise on
11 farther east .
12 And so I think rainfall in that area , as
13 well , could aid in recharging this area . But it ' s
14 primarily the ditch that ' s the most likely , more
15 logical source of the water .
16 COMMISSIONER BAXTER : Thank you .
17 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Any other
18 questions ?
19 I ' m not sure what -- I ' m sorry , did you
20 have another question? Dale , go ahead .
21 COMMISSIONER HALL : I guess I just have a
22 couple thoughts here that I ' m trying to get plain in
23 my mind here .
24 Your nine-page report here talks a little
25 bit about -- or probably quite a bit about this being
258
1 incompatible with the area around it . Where you cite
2 on page 4 , where you cite about the comprehensive
3 plan , page 2-2 , agricultural uses , where you want to
4 take care of the conflicts between agricultural uses
5 and residential , commercial and industrial uses . But
- 6 yet it seems like someone ' s trying to portray this as
7 not an agricultural use . What would you consider a
8 dairy?
9 MR . COAN : What do I consider a dairy ?
10 COMMISSIONER HALL : Yeah .
11 MR . COAN : Is this what rises to the
12 industrial dairy type question?
13 COMMISSIONER HALL : Do you consider it an
14 agricultural use?
15 MR . COAN : I consider it to have origins in
16 agriculture . I consider it to be an agricultural use
17 myself . I think it -- at a certain point , though , it
18 can -- it ' s impacts past the property line can be
19 different than what people traditionally think of as
20 ag -- an agricultural use .
21 I don ' t have a bright line difference and
22 maybe it ' s -- to me , it can do -- it ' s an
23 agricultural use , as far as I ' m concerned , but the
24 intensity of it creates impacts that aren ' t
25 traditionally thought of as being related to
259
1 agricultural uses .
2 COMMISSIONER HALL : So how would you
3 consider the -- the areas around it , such as the ,
4 what we ' ve heard earlier as hobby farms , or I know
5 there are other larger farms that are within the same
6 general vicinity? I mean , is that residential or is
7 that agricultural ?
8 MR . COAN : I think it ' s a rural residential
9 is what I would think of it as . You know , it ' s
10 interesting to note , and I ' ve struggled with this
11 term in your documents before , but your documents say
12 that urban scale development is five lots .
13 And I ' ve struggled with that term before
14 because that five lots applies to development that
15 has five lots on 360 acres and it applies to a
16 development of five lots on , you know , 10 acres .
17 But , you know , your documents do call anything more
18 than five lots urban scale development .
19 COMMISSIONER HALL : So what is the rural
20 residential , though , to you? Is that 1 —acre lots ,
21 2—acre lots , or is that --
22 MR . COAN : I think that -- and I think
23 you ' re asking me my own personal opinions on this
24 stuff , and I ' m glad to give those to you .
25 COMMISSIONER HALL : You wrote the nine-page
260
1 report , so I guess I ' m trying to get some information
2 on --
3 MR . COAN : Sure , I understand . To put it
4 in context , your comprehensive plan indicates that
5 anything less than 80 acres is not economically
6 viable as a farming operation . And so I guess my --
7 my opinion is that when you get below 80 acres ,
8 you ' re talking about a hobby farm or rural
9 residential parcel rather than an agricultural lot
10 where somebody makes their living from agriculture .
11 COMMISSIONER HALL : Well , then you go on
12 to say in this that the subject application does not
13 preserve farmland . So what are you trying to
14 preserve if it ' s not farmland?
15 MR . COAN : I ' m glad you brought that up .
16 And I suppose I may not be aware of your
17 interpretations of it , but it seems to me that if you
18 have prime farmland , or prime if irrigated farmland ,
19 what that designation means is that you have certain
20 types of soils that are conducive to producing crops ,
21 producing crops if it ' s irrigated , or producing crops
22 otherwise , if it ' s prime .
23 The difficulty I have with saying this is
24 an appropriate use of those soils , is it does not
25 make use of those soils for production of crops . You
261
1 can locate a dairy in the sand hills and function
2 just -- just fine , whereas you may not be able to
3 produce a high-value crop in those sand hills .
4 COMMISSIONER HALL : But I guess the
5 point -- the question I have is , if you are saying
6 that it ' s not really farmland out there , it ' s --
7 they ' re small hobby farms , or whatever you might want
8 to call it , what -- I guess I don ' t understand where
9 the application is .
10 MR . COAN : The particular site is
11 designated as prime and one small strip is prime if
12 irrigated . And the point I ' m trying to make in my
13 letter , and in my presentation , is that that
14 designation is relevant to crop production . You
15 don ' t need those types of soils for a dairy
16 operation .
17 It might be relevant to have those types of
18 soils for the area that ' s used in the nutrient
19 management plan , but for siting a dairy you don ' t
20 need prime and prime if irrigated soils . In fact , I
21 think those soils are more appropriate for crop
22 production and they should be preserved for that .
23 COMMISSIONER HALL : Well , it just seems
24 like we ' re being a little inconsistent here . It
25 seems like we ' re -- we ' re trying to call it farmland
262
1 on one side , but yet it ' s not farmland when you want
2 to have an ag industry going in there . So I guess
3 that ' s -- I see a conflict in there and I ' m not able
4 to get past it what I ' m concerned with here on that
5 end of it .
6 And I guess , to me , if you ' re talking about
7 that self-prime land in there , you ' re making a big
8 argument against approving any of these red dots that
9 are not already there , because that ' s going to take
10 away prime farmland , too . And so it wouldn ' t be
11 compatible with what ' s already out there .
12 So I guess I ' m trying to figure out the
13 compatibility issue , if you ' re considering it
14 farmland that you don ' t want to have things taken out
15 of prime farmland area and things along those lines ,
16 it ' s either residential or it ' s farmland . And I hear
17 you saying both sides of the coin is --
18 MR . COAN : I think what you have existing
19 around the property is what I would call rural
20 residential . The majority of those parcels are under
21 100 acres , under 80 acres , and they don ' t make their
22 living there , they ' re rural residential properties ,
23 but they ' re existing .
24 The designation of prime and prime if
25 irrigated , again , to me , becomes important if what
263
1 your goal is is to have crop production .
2 It ' s not -- you ' re not pro -- you ' re
3 preserving it for agriculture if you call dairy
4 agriculture . And I agree , it is ; but you ' re not
5 preserving it for the use that it ' s valuable for ,
6 which is crop production .
7 COMMISSIONER HALL : And then you go on to
8 say the predominant future land use for this area
9 should be residential ?
10 MR . COAN : I think that that ' s consistent
11 with the trend in the area . And if I say should be ,
12 maybe --
__ 13 COMMISSIONER HALL : Will . You said will ,
14 I ' m sorry .
15 MR . COAN : I think that ' s a reasonable
16 expectation .
17 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : May I follow-up?
18 This is an agricultural zoned district ,
19 correct? You ' re aware that this is -- all of that
20 out there is zoned agriculture .
21 MR . COAN : Yes .
22 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : And are you aware
23 what the intent of the agricultural zoned district
24 is ?
25 MR . COAN : I ' ve read it .
264
1 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Okay . Just to kind
2 of follow-up on some of Commissioner Hall ' s comments ,
3 because you ' ve mentioned several times -- in fact ,
4 you started off your -- your statements by saying
5 that the board had a duty under the Weld County
6 comprehensive plan to recognize their role in
7 reducing the conflicts between agriculture and
8 residential , essentially , and you quoted page 2-2
9 which is under the agricultural section of the
10 comprehensive plan . And you also quoted underneath
11 the subsection of concerns of farming as an industry .
12 So I think you were trying -- it seemed to
13 me like you were interpreting and maybe took this out
14 of context , implying that it ' s up to us to reduce the
15 conflicts from agriculture encroaching upon urban or
16 residential development , but I would just read you
17 some of the other sentences that are within that
18 section .
19 The paragraph just prior to that reads that
20 many of the problems stem from unrealistic
21 expectations of those seeking a rural lifestyle .
22 Tension between farming and nonfarming uses occurring
23 from restrictions on normal farming practices in
24 areas , encroached upon residential uses .
25 There are other areas in here , because you
265
1 were trying to , I think , at least , give direction to
2 the board that we should -- and I do take my role
3 very responsible -- you know , very responsible about
4 my role here , but that we should look at the other
5 goals and policies within the agriculture
6 comprehensive -- or the agricultural part of the
7 comprehensive plan .
8 But just so you know , the Weld County
9 agricultural goals and policies have been developed
10 to support and preserve the agricultural industry and
11 farming activities .
12 So I think where your interpretation is , is
13 that agriculture should not encroach upon
14 residential , I think in the agricultural zoned
15 district , I think the comprehensive plan is stating
16 that we -- our role is to reduce the conflicts from
17 the residential or urban encroachment upon
18 agriculture , not the other way around .
19 And it also , I will tell you , that within
20 here in the appendix is the Right-To-Farm Covenant
21 which also gives further guidance to the Board of
22 County Commissioners . And it ' s on 7-1 .
23 But it talks about how Weld County ' s one of
24 the most productive agricultural counties in the
25 United States , but agriculture users of the land
266
1 should not be expected to change their
2 long-established agriculture practices to accommodate
3 the intrusions of urban users into the rural area .
4 So those are just some of the things that I
5 noticed from the comprehensive plan that I also
6 noticed that you failed to incorporate into your
7 comment .
8 MR . COAN : I can appreciate that
9 perspective . And I think it ' s also important for the
10 commissioners , and I believe the intent is there for
11 you to look both directions when you ' re approving
12 land uses . Not just when you ' re approving
13 residential in an agricultural area , but also when
14 you ' re approaching USRs that allow something
15 significantly more than the use-by-right in an
16 agricultural zone .
17 So I think that that provision , as I read
18 it , provides guidance that you can and should look
19 both directions when you ' re looking at land uses .
20 The end statement is to try to reduce
21 conflicts between the different types of uses . I
22 think what you ' ve heard from the entire neighborhood
23 is that the conflict here arises when you go over the
24 use-by-right . If you ' re going to talk about 4 , 000
25 animals on this site , that ' s where the conflict comes
267
1 in .
2 They ' re willing to accept the collateral
3 effects , whatever irritations there are , whatever
4 nuisances there are , of a use-by-right . And I don ' t
5 think you ' ll see conflicts from that . And you -- we
6 wouldn ' t be here with , you know , 20 or so , 30 , 40
7 people , however many it is , upset and concerned about
8 this use if we were talking about the use-by-right .
9 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Well , since you
10 brought that up , let me just read to you a couple of
11 sentences out of the intent of the agricultural zone
12 district .
13 The first is -- and I can read them all
14 because they all would apply here , but I ' ll just read
15 the ones that are more pertinent to your comments .
16 The agricultural district is established
17 and maintained to promote agriculture as an essential
18 feature of the county .
19 The agricultural district is intended to
20 provide areas for the conduct of agricultural
21 activities and activities related to agriculture and
22 agriculture production without the interference of
23 other incompatible land uses .
24 The agricultural district is also intended
25 to provide areas for the conduct of uses by special
268
1 review which have been determined to be more intense
2 or have a potentially greater impact than uses
3 allowed by right .
4 So it is -- it is the intent of the
5 agricultural district to allow those types of uses .
6 That ' s why we are here going , though , through the
7 permit process and why the board does have to look at
8 criteria that are set forth in determining whether or
9 not it ' s compatible and also whether or not the
10 applicant is showing that they ' re able to mitigate
11 any potential or possible negative impacts .
12 MR . COAN : And I think that ' s why -- I
13 don ' t think that there ' s a presumption in your
14 ordinance that says the USR is appropriate in every
15 site , if it ' s an agricultural USR .
16 And that ' s why we have a site specific
17 review of the application and why we take into
18 consideration existing surrounding land uses . So I
19 think -- I think I agree with every word you ' re
20 saying about the comprehensive plan and the intent ,
21 when you talk about the use-by-right for this
22 particular parcel . But when you talk about 4 , 000
23 head dairy for this particular parcel , I think that
24 that ' s why you have a site specific review , that ' s
25 why you take a look at the agricultural use at that
269
1 intensity with a jaundiced eye , if you will , and give
2 the applicant the burden of proving that his use will
3 not have unreasonable impacts on the surrounding
4 properties .
5 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Any further
6 questions? Commissioner .
7 COMMISSIONER VAAD : Well , if I might , when
8 you directed our attention to maybe we ' re not stating
9 strongly enough to people who move into these
10 agricultural areas that they run up against the
11 problems , were you suggesting that having the
12 right-to-farm covenant made -- have the applicants
13 made aware of that is not strong enough and that we
14 should do something in addition to that?
15 MR . COAN : Well , I think that -- again , I
16 think your right-to-farm covenant is good and it ' s
17 appropriate . And it applies to 4 out of the 50—some
18 residences -- or four lots , in this particular
19 circumstance .
20 Again , I think that the reason you have a
21 USR is that it may not be appropriate for every site .
22 It may not be appropriate for this site . And you ' re
23 supposed to take a look at it on a site specific
24 basis . And , sure , there are effects from the
25 use-by-right and that ' s what I think your
270
1 right-to-farm covenant does make people aware of , and
2 does give the agricultural operator something to rely
3 on and something for the commissioners to point to if
4 you receive complaints .
5 But I still think that when you have a
6 separate process that is a site specific review and
7 the applicant has the burden of proving
8 compatibility , you need to consider that the
9 presumption is there that it ' s not necessarily
10 appropriate on every site . Our contention is this
11 particular site is not appropriate for 4 , 000 cows .
12 CHAIRWOMAN KIRKMEYER : Any further
13 questions?
14 Okay . Thank you .
15 MR . COAN : Thank you .
16 ( The rebuttal statements made , and the
17 final comments by the county commissioners ,
-- 18 are in a separate transcript , previously
19 transcribed . )
20
21
22
23
24
25
271
1 REPORTER ' S CERTIFICATE
2 I , Mary J . George , a Registered
3 Professional Reporter , Registered Merit Reporter ,
4 Certified Realtime Reporter , and Notary Public within
5 the State of Colorado , appointed to take the public
6 hearing , do hereby certify that the hearing was taken
7 by me at 915 10th Street , Greeley , Colorado , on
8 December 13 , 2000 ; that the proceedings were
9 thereafter reduced to typewritten form by means of
10 computer-integrated transcription ; that the foregoing
11 is an accurate transcript of the proceedings at that
12 time .
13 I further certify that I am not related to ,
14 employed by , nor of counsel for any of the parties or
15 attorneys herein , nor otherwise interested in the
16 result of the within action .
17 In witness whereof , I have affixed my
18 signature and seal this 15th day of February , 2001 .
19 My commission expires October 2 , 2002 .
2 o a4.t tcu%mml4,0
\21 � P• 9c/'
MARY Atorw---
22 =*° ® * Regi ter d Professional Reporter
'°UBLVV ' Cert ficate of Merit Holder
23 f� 9 O ..... �o\`` Certified Realtime Reporter
,OF
01.%,
25
PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
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PUBLIC BEARING of DECEMBER 13, 2000
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PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
Page 4
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Wilson George Court Reporters,Inc.
PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
Page 5
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PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
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PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
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PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
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PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
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Wilson George Court Reporters,Inc.
PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
Page 10
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Wilson George Court Reporters,Inc.
PUBLIC HEARING of DECEMBER 13,2000
Page 11
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