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Home My WebLink About20012816.tiff HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES June 6, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Jim Anderson Chuck Carlson Wade Carlson Don Cummins Bill Garcia Bill Hopkins Jackie Johnson Dwaine Kurtz MEMBERS ABSENT: Mark Gray ALSO PRESENT: Bruce Barker, County Attorney Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board The following business was transacted: Mike Geile, Board of County Commissioners Chair, opened the meeting at 7:10 p.m. and asked each individual to introduce himself. Commissioner Geile then gave an introduction as to why the committee was formed and emphasized there is no preset agenda for this committee. He stated the Charter has not been updated since the late 1980's, except for the special election at the time The Villa case was heard. Commissioner Geile stated the Board would like to complete the review this summer, thereby fitting any changes into the 2001 election schedule. To meet that schedule, the committee will need to complete its recommendation by August 10; however,a few more weeks can be added if necessary, so long as the recommendation is received by September 1, 2001. Commissioner Geile said the committee was formed with an array of people with very diverse backgrounds, hopefully to generate good ideas about what changes should be made to the Charter, if any. Commissioners Vaad,Jerke, Long,and Masden each stated their thanks to the members for giving time to serve on the committee and added their comments. Commissioner Geile stated the county will provide for any forums, etc., that the committee deems desirable, and further stated all county resources are available to assist in this process, and the committee has the full support of the Board. Bruce Barker, County Attorney, stated the committee needs to elect a Chair and Vice Chair, and stated the committee should determine its approach to the study and set its schedule. He said the resolution shows the timeframe involved, however, the final date possible to make the election deadline, would be for the Board of County Commissioners to act on the recommendation at its September 10, 2001, meeting, in order to submit to the Clerk and Recorder by September 12, 2001. Mr. Barker reviewed the notebook provided, stating this is the same procedure that was used in 1988 when the last revision was done. He indicated the memo to department heads and 2001-2816 a Cools elected officials,and the press release for the purpose of obtaining public input. He indicated there is also a copy of the current Home Rule Charter, discussed the codification process recently completed and indicated the website address where the Code and Charter are available. Mr. Barker stated staff will act at the direction of the committee, and both he and Don Warden will be available to facilitate this process in any way possible. Dwaine Kurtz suggested Don Cummins act as Temporary Chair. Mr. Cummins stated he would do so, and would nominate Jackie Johnson as Chair of the committee. Chuck Carlson seconded the nomination and moved the committee appoint her as Chair by acclamation. All were in favor of the motion. Ms.Johnson asked for nominations for Vice Chair. Chuck Carlson nominated Don Cummins ,and Wade Carlson seconded. The nomination carried unanimously. Ms. Johnson asked if there were any objections to first hearing Mr. Barker discuss the three issues he would like to address. There being none, Mr. Barker indicated there have been a number of changes in the Colorado Constitution. The first occurred in 1994 and deals with term limits, now limiting all county offices to two terms. He stated the Act specifically refers to Home Rule counties, therefore, at this time Weld County officials are limited to two terms. The Home Rule county may decide for itself the length of the terms, and the committee needs to decide whether to recommend modification of the Charter to either clarify or change this portions. Ms. Johnson stated the committee should address this issue, even if they recommend leaving it the same. Mr. Barker stated the next issue are qualifications for the office of Sheriff. In 1996, training and certification requirements were enacted. Section 10-1 of the Charter already addresses qualifications; however these need to be reviewed and, perhaps, some stated added that in case of conflict, the Charter qualifications apply. The third issue discussed by Mr. Barker has to do with a change in 1981 concerning ordinance capabilities of counties. Initially only Home Rule counties could enact ordinances; however, changes to the statutes now allow any county to have ordinance capabilities. Mr. Barker said it is now on a list of things the counties can do, although Home Rule counties still have more authority. Now the statute says if you are going to adopt ordinances, refer back to the newer statutes. Mr. Barker indicated one part that might be beneficial to Weld County is the three readings of an ordinance, which has been modified. Responding to Ms. Johnson, Mr. Barker indicated our process is more restrictive than the statutes. Mr. Barker stated the Code adoption provisions are being reviewed by Lee Morrison, Assistant County Attorney, as well as changes to the election code. Mr. Barker indicated one change is the statute no longer refers to a "qualified elector", rather it calls them "registered electors." Also qualifications of registered electors are now defined in the election code,and the committee needs to determine whether to clarify the difference between the two. Mr. Barker indicated there is also a change in the petition process, specifically in how it is handled and time frames. He stated Mr. Morrison is looking at coordinating the Charter with the statutes for ease of process in the procedures for dealing with petitions and referendums. Mr. Barker said there is also a recent law regarding referendums from municipalities dealing with land use issues. He stated the Board of County Commissioners has quasi-judicial powers to deal with land use cases, with a capability to appeal through the District Court. The committee needs to determine whether to change the Charter to reflect this recent change. Charter Study Committee June 6, 2001, Page 2 Mr. Barker stated that, although the language in the Charter is a bit outdated, it may be more trouble than its worth to try to change it without changing the content. Ms. Johnson asked what other areas the committee members would like to see discussed, and stated it might be best to set up subcommittees for the various areas. Mr. Cummins said he would like to look at whether all county officers should be elected, and whether some are required to be elected. He stated more professional abilities are needed for some, such as the Assessor or Treasurer, although others are more administrative. Bill Hopkins stated some counties have looked at that,and it deserves discussion. Mr. Chuck Carlson indicated it was a hot topic during the original Charter committee process and the public definitely wanted elected officials, although the qualifications for the Sheriff evolved out of that discussion. Mr. Hopkins stated some of that is dependent on the dynamics of time, which may have changed. Mr. Kurtz stated no county has removed officials from an elected status, and Ms. Johnson stated that, as a Home Rule County,we have the authority to make those offices appointed instead of elected. Mr. Kurt stated at the time of the original Charter there was more fear and/or anger, against the Board of Commissioners at that time, with lots of resentment and the body politic has lost the image of a "totalitarian" existence. Bill Garcia questioned why the County Attorney is appointed, although the Coroner is not, since both are more administrative than political, and stated he is curious about current public feeling. Ms. Johnson stated that can be a topic for discussion in the future, since more public input is needed. Mr. Chuck Carlson stated he would like to have something presented to deal with growth in the county, with Weld County being so diversified. He said he can live with some state laws, however, he would like to see if Weld County can do its own planning to avoid state control or direction in land use cases and he would like to talk to the Comprehensive Plan committee one night for discussion. Mr. Barker cautioned that county home rule is for the purpose of structure and is different from city home rule. Regardless of home rule,the county is an arm of the state and where a home rule city has some ability to put planning into its Charter and enact ordinances to carry out policies, etc., for land use, he does not feel a county has that same authority through its Charter. He stated the Board of County Commissioners enacts policies,such as the Zoning Ordinance, and the Charter sets up the structure of government, with two exceptions. One exception is landfills and the other was an amendment in 1995 regarding the citing of pre-parole facilities. Mr. Barker advised against making any sort of policy statements and, if the Department of Planning Services should be structured differently, the committee can recommend to do so; however, the functions and policies should be set by the Board of County Commissioners,to be in conformance with state statutes. Mr. Barker stated a county can only do what the state legislature says it can do, and the difference currently is small. Mr. Garcia stated he was surprised to learn a vacancy in the office of Commissioner is filled by County council, and that he would like to look at whether it is necessary to require a leave of absence when an employee is running for office. Mr. Hopkins stated he would like to look at this issue, as to why it would be good or bad, and that it might be possible to put limitations on the campaign to deal with the job issues. Ms.Johnson stated she would like to address Section 2-4 which has service district language which is antiquated and to add language requiring redistricting of Commissioner districts afer a census. She also said Tom David, previous County Attorney, who is concerned with the removal of an employee formally charged with a crime or indited for a crime. He stated there is now case law referencing due process where the employee has been charged with a crime instead of indited. Charter Study Committee June 6, 2001, Page 3 Ms. Johnson stated procedurally it would be better to have public input sooner rather than later, although Mr. Kurtz said it might expedite the process to hear from the elected officials first and take more time with public input. Mr. Barker reiterated the committee can recommend changes to any functional issue. Mr. Johnson reiterated qualifications and term limits should be addressed, and Mr. Hopkins suggested asking for a response to the specific issues from those who work with it most. After discussion, Ms. Johnson asked Mr. Barker to revise the draft memo to include specific issues and invite the elected officials and department heads to bring other issues to the committee. She also stated perhaps staff can present the pros and cons of other issues regarding compliance with statutes at the next meeting, since they are ready to do so at this time. Mr. Hopkins questioned whether to add some type of job performance for elected officials,although Mr. Barker stated it would not be enforceable if the standards were not met. After further discussion,the committee agreed to meet June 20, 2001,to hear from staff regarding compliance issues;distribute the written responses received from elected officials and department heads; and determine subcommittees. (Mr. Cummins was excused from the meeting.) Ms. Johnson asked for any public comments. Sheriff Ed Jordan stated the elected official would definitely like to give their input, and he reviewed the history of the amendment to statute regarding qualifications being required for Sheriffs. Dave Malcom stated regarding elected officials the salaries need to be commensurate with the job required, that Weld County pays below other counties, and one revision should be to require the compensation for elected officials to be commensurate with other counties in the State. Frank Stewart encouraged the committee to look at what is needed and said he is sure the changes, if recommended, will be worthwhile. He stated he appreciates the opportunity for open, public comment. Betty Ehn stated some very touchy matters are going to be discussed, and she appreciates the committee allowing her to listen to the discussions. Mr. Kurtz suggested the committee might need to meet weekly and stated he would like to have a schedule up front instead of scheduling the meetings one at a time. Ms. Johnson suggested the first meeting be held June 20, 2001, as discussed above, then meet again on July 11, 2001, with weekly meetings after that point. Ms. Johnson also asked the Clerk to call and remind committee members of the meetings. There being no further business, Ms. Johnson adjourned the meeting at 8:45 p.m. Let the minutes reflect the above and foregoing actions are respectfully submitted by the Acting Clerk to the Board. Carol A. Harding Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee June 6, 2001, Page 4 HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES June 20, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Wade Carlson Don Cummins Bill Garcia Bill Hopkins Jackie Johnson Dwaine Kurtz MEMBERS ABSENT: Mark Gray Jim Anderson (Clerk's Note: Resigned on June 18, 2001) ALSO PRESENT: Don Warden, Director, Finance and Administration Bruce Barker, County Attorney Lee Morrison, Assistant County Attorney Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Chair Jackie Johnson called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m. Bill Garcia questioned whether all elected and appointed offices should be reviewed,instead of only elected positions,and stated he would also like to look at vacancies in elected offices and how they are filled. Responding to Jackie, Bill Garcia explained looking at the other side, i.e., whether currently appointed positions should be elected, seems to be a healthy way to look at that issue from all sides. Bruce Barker, County Attorney, stated the committee can open it up to whatever discussion they desire. Jackie determined the consensus of the committee is that anything regarding elected officials should remain in the domain of the entire committee and should not be assigned to any subcommittee, and she reviewed her letter which was sent to committee members on June 12, 2001, defining 11 issues to be discussed, as well as suggested subcommittee appointments. The 11 issues are: 1) term limits for elected officials; 2) whether the offices of Assessor, Clerk and Recorder, Coroner, Sheriff and Treasurer should be elected or appointed; 3)the setting of salaries for elected officials; 4) qualifications and standards of performance for elected officials; 5) the employment status of county employees seeking elective office; 6) changing the three-reading requirement for county ordinances; 7) changes related to the Colorado Election Code including definition of "qualified elector", recall provisions, and referendum and initiative provisions; 8)whether referendum should be available in land use decisions; 9) whether the Charter should require the County Council to provide due process procedures prior to removal of an elected officer who has been indicted; 10) mandatory redistricting following a census; and 11) changes related to Section 2-4 regarding service districts. Jackie stated she is planning to take public input from elected officials beginning on July 11, 2001, continuing to July 18, 2001, if necessary. She also distributed two written responses which were received from Sheriff Ed Jordan and Assessor Stan Sessions. Wade Carlson stated he would still like a written response as a point of contact before meeting with them; however, it is okay if they do not send one. The committee then broke into subcommittees for discussion as follows: 1) Issues#6, 7, and 11 with Jim Anderson, Bill Hopkins, and Jackie Johnson (Lee Morrison); 2) Issues #5 and 9 with Bill Garcia, Mark Gray,and Dwaine Kurtz(Bruce Barker);and 3) Issues#8 and 10 with Chuck Carlson, Wade Carlson, and Don Cummins (Don Warden). Upon reconvening, Bill Garcia reviewed the findings of their subcommittee and stated regarding Issue #9, concerning due process prior to removal of an elected officer who has been indited of a crime,the comments by Cyndy Giauque state if the County Council is contemplating suspension without pay, the elected official should be entitled to due process; however, if suspension is with pay, no hearing is necessary. Bill stated the subcommittee agreed that Section 13-8(5) be amended to add language stating the County Council may suspend the elected official without pay after notice and hearing by the Council to afford such officer the opportunity to address the facts and allegations set forth in the charge or indictment. He stated the amendment would make treatment of elected officials comparable to treatment of County employees; it would not require a formal evidentiary hearing, which is already in place; and the County Council would decide after the hearing whether or not to suspend the elected official. Bill further reported the second paragraph of Section 13-8(5)takes care of the instance where the accused is found to be not guilty,with the County Council reinstating the elected official, including back pay;and the subcommittee recommends language stating"the officer shall be reinstated and receive back pay." This would take the County Council out of the position of having to have another meeting upon determination of the official's innocence, thus removing a step from the procedure. It also clarifies the term "forthwith" means, in that if the elected official is found guilty, removal is automatic. The official's due process would be in the criminal trial, like any other county personnel. Bill also said they discussed whether a clarification of the definition of crime should be included, since it is difficult to determine whether a Class I or Class II misdemeanor should be included, for instance, in recent cases where a DUI would automatically suspend the official from office;and said the subcommittee needs further study as to what is involved in a Class I or Class II misdemeanor, furthermore, to determine what State law is in order to determine whether the Charter is more restrictive or less. Dwaine Kurtz stated further information is necessary to determine State law in order to compare it with the Charter. In regards to Issue#5, Bill stated a County employee seeking election currently has to request a leave of absence without pay once he has announced for that office,and he said several questions arose, specifically, what if an employee of Weld County lives in Larimer County, then decides to run for office in Larimer County. The Charter currently would prevent that option; however, inclusion of the words "seeks election to partisan public office in Weld County" or a change from "announcement" to "primary" or"after primary is resolved"would also help. Another possibility is someone who wishes to run for office in a department different from where he works, i.e., a Sheriff's Deputy running for County Clerk, and limiting language may need to be included for this instance, as well as for the possibility of a Deputy Sheriff running for Sheriff when office is an open seat. Responding to Wade as to the rationale behind this inclusion in the Charter, Don Warden stated it is potentially disruptive to the workforce if another individual in the office running against the incumbent and, even if the Sheriff is not running, but several different employees are, there would be divisiveness within the office, or possibly an undermining of the elected official who is running, and individuals could be forced into taking sides. Don also responded it would not be much of a problem if it is the elected official or incumbent who is running. Bill Garcia stated it is necessary to protect the integrity of civil service and disruption in the office and also stated there is Georgia Charter Study Committee June 20, 2001, Page 2 case law regarding this. Chuck said it would be disruptive if several were running in one department. Discussion followed regarding particular problems that could arise. Don Cummins reported his subcommittee determined the Charter allows redistricting and reads it "may be done," which ignores State statute requirements that it shall be done at a minimum following each census, and recommended language be added stating redistricting "Will be done every ten, but if necessary, may be done every 2 years" in order to keep the Board of County Commissioners from ignoring State-required redistricting after each census. Don Cummins also said that regarding the referendum, the recommendation is to leave as it is since it is complex and would take too much explanation for the citizens to understand the recommended changes. Responding to Jackie, Bruce explained this issue evolved out of a vested rights case in which the Board of County Commissioners,in 1994,approved a final PUD application submitted by The Villa. After the Board approved the PUD,a 106 action was taken to District Court to appeal the Board's decision, and the Court found favorably for the County. The parties then went to the Court of Appeals and were trying to do a referendum; however, they never got around to doing it. Since they did not get what they wanted,they tried an amendment to the Charter,which was an initiated amendment to require a vote before a jail, correctional facility,or pre-parole facility could be sited in Weld County. Bruce said they wanted a decision which would make it so there was no possibility of a retroactive amendment; however, the Court of Appeals said it was an amendment of the people, therefore, the people could vote. Further, the Court of Appeals said, if the vote is against siting of the facility, there was provision for payment of siting which had already occurred. Don Cummins said the subcommittee discussed whether statutory rights would be prohibited, and that vested rights were amended in 1999 which says if an application for land use is filed, the applicant is locked into what was in effect at the time the application was received; therefore, he would not have to deal with a later amendment to the Charter. The problem is that there are some references to the zoning law and the zoning plan, so it is not 100 percent clear and does provide the basis for argument. Don further stated that the provision should not work retroactively, since substantial liability would be present; however, the concern is if it were put to a vote but turned down, an enterprising attorney could argue the electorate could have prevented it but the failure to pass implies they were unwilling to amend the Charter this way. Don stated he feels the electorate would likely not understand the issue, and a no vote might be worse than an informed vote; also, he is unsure how such a complex issue could be easily presented to the electorate. Jackie stated she would be careful of any limits on a referendum, and the committee will wrestle with its recommendation, as well as how many changes to recommend. She does not feel the committee should make political judgements, simply to list what is wrong and let the politicians decide what goes to the voters. Bill Hopkins said this issue is complex, but it should be part of the report that is submitted to the Board of County Commissioners, who will have to use its discretion and authority. He would like to include everything that is out of sync in the Charter. Jackie reported in regards to service districts, the term "service district" no longer appears in statutes and is ambiguous. The Charter intermixes the terms"service district"and"special district" and the subcommittee recommends elimination of the term. Regarding the Ordinance Process, Jackie explained the Charter requires three readings, statutes require two, thus the Charter allows for more public input which the subcommittee does not recommend tampering with; however, it does recommend the addition of language to include the amount of time allowed for a person to file a referendum on an issue. Charter Study Committee June 20, 2001, Page 3 Concerning the Election Code with respect to the number of signatures required, she said the Charter requires five percent of the total voting in the prior election; however, statute requires five percent of the registered electors,which would be higher. The subcommittee felt the lower number would be preferable, although the question came up as to whether the Election Code was in effect at the time the Charter was approved. If not, the subcommittee would want to remove the entire section and follow the entire Election Code rather than have portions included in the Charter. Lee will be doing further research on the Election Code. Jackie explained there is no guidance for the ordinance procedure,we did it prior to a statutory requirement,therefore, it would probably prevail. Responding to Bill Garcia, Jackie clarified the subcommittee recommendation is to leave the Charter as it is if it was consistent with State statute at the time the Charter was adopted. Dwaine presented a request from John Folsom which was sent to the County Council, in regards to conflict of interest, asking that it be a conflict of interest for a county officer, member of appointed board or commission, or employee of Weld County to carry a petition. He explained as background that this came about because during a recent election,elected officials carried petitions and secured signatures, therefore, Mr. Folsom prepared this. Jackie recommended the committee study all the information received and have a press release available so the committee will receive input from elected officials on July 11, 2001, with respect to any issues they want to raise. If more time is needed to receive this input, July 18, 2001, will also be used, then begin to receive public input on July 18, 2001. After discussion regarding location of meetings to receive public testimony, it was determined the issues already identified should be made available to the public, and holding three meetings throughout the County might be the best approach. Bill Hopkins cautioned that if only some of the committee members go to each meeting, responses given do not split the committee intellectually in terms of how to address each issue. Jackie stated she agrees the smaller groups of the committee would not be in a position to respond, and would only take input, not give responses. Bill also suggested all media inquiries be referred to Jackie so only one voice speaks for the entire committee. Jackie reviewed the upcoming schedule as follows: July 11, elected officials address the committee and they are encouraged to provide written comments in advance;July 18,finish elected officials comments if necessary, and address unfinished items which were discussed tonight; July 25 or following week - receive public input from public at large; the next meeting would then be used for the committee to debate all the issues and form its recommendation. After discussion, it was decided to consider the options available for smaller meetings to hear public input and decide on July 11 where those should be held. Jackie also requested the materials presented to each subcommittee be sent to each member. Don Warden suggested the First Floor meeting room be used instead of 350, since there is more room. The meeting was adjourned at 9:20 p.m. 1,A Carol A. Harding Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee June 20, 2001, Page 4 HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES July 11, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Wade Carlson Bill Garcia Bill Hopkins Jackie Johnson Dwaine (Duane) Kurtz Mark Gray MEMBERS ABSENT: Don Cummins ALSO PRESENT: Art Willis, Treasurer Stan Sessions, Assessor Scott Anthony, Coroner Al Dominguez, D.A. Ed Jordan, Sheriff Doug Rademacher, County Council Suki Tsukamoto, Clerk and Recorder Bruce Barker, County Attorney Don Warden, Director of Finance &Administration Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Chair Jackie Johnson called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m. and stated this evening we will hear as much public testimony as permitted by time constraints, beginning with any matters elected officials have regarding the Weld County Charter, specifically those sections dealing with elected officials. Responding to Jackie, Dwaine asked permission of the committee to distribute a Greeley Tribune article with comments from a former elected official. Jackie also verified all members received letters from Mr. & Mrs. Evans, and a letter to Mr. Warden from Joyce Smock, County Council. Jackie stated for clarification that the committee has not made any decision or reached any conclusion, and all those items being looked at are issues that have been brought to committee members either by a friend or associate, or through their own knowledge of the Charter. She reiterated the committee is hearing input only at this point, the committee will then deliberate and make its recommendation. Ed Jordan,Sheriff,stated he feels an obligation to inform the committee of his opinion. Term limits, as they currently stand, will not allow him to run for another term; although he wants to remain in the community and continue to be active in the political process. Sheriff Jordan said if he were appointed or hired he would either not be here, or he would be espousing the opinion of those who appointed him. He stated government must change to keep up with business procedures and, although there have been numerous changes in all county offices and departments, more will be required in the future. He stated the Internet alone will dramatically change the interaction between citizens and government,and any changes to the structure of government must be evaluated very • carefully. Sheriff Jordan stated there may be occasions where an elected official may be inefficient or even commit a crime; however, it does not happen with any frequency. He has observed the process of running the county from the inside and, compared to other entities, Weld County leads the way or is on the cutting edge of initiating many new procedures,which suggests Weld County is not in need of change. Sheriff Jordan also spoke about the separation of power to keep the various branches of a governmental entity in check to avoid having one branch gain control or power over another and how the public must remain in control of its elected officials. He also stated the public prefers to vote on more issues, not less, and noted new technologies will make voting more accessible and easier in the future. Sheriff Jordan reiterated the Sheriff specifically must have the ability to investigate any crime, regardless of who hired him; stated he is not a big fan of term limits, he feels the public limits terms at the poles; an employee should be allowed to run for election without taking a leave of absence, unless he is running for the same office as his boss; and evaluations and standards for elected officials would be confusing, and it would be difficult to know who should evaluate and determine the standards. Responding to Dwaine regarding specific qualifications for the Sheriff, Sheriff Jordan stated he believes the public is competent enough to make those decisions, and the current qualifications which were added at the State level has alleviated some of the past problems. He did clarify the Charter requirements supercede State requirements, therefore, five years of experience is required. Sheriff Jordan stated he would hate to limit someone not qualified if they could get the necessary training within his first year of office, although most individuals running would already have experience. Chuck stated the qualifications of the Undersheriff was more of a concern than Sheriff. Jackie asked for clarification from Sheriff Jordan regarding his remarks that an appointed Sheriff being subject to more political pressure than an elected Sheriff. He responded that there are numerous Police Chiefs around the country who are subject to political pressure, although sometimes it is hidden; however, the tenure average in the United States is about 2'1A years, and the main reason Police Chiefs were not retained was political, they were gaining too much power, etc. Sheriff Jordan also stated he has seen Chiefs ordered to take certain action on cases instead of being able to make a neutral decision on what action is necessary. He stated an independently elected Sheriff does not have to answer to anyone but the voters; and the County Commissioners do not set policy within his office, they only approve his budget, therefore, there is no worry about being fired for his actions or decisions regarding policy. Responding to Bill Hopkins questions about an employee running for office, Sheriff Jordan stated it would be okay if the incumbent was not running;and in cases where the incumbent is supporting someone else running for office, it might be divisive, however, the elected official should be able to maintain control in the office atmosphere of both candidates. Stan Sessions,Assessor, stated his opinion was communicated in the memo he sent. He said he voted for term limits; however, now he has mixed feelings, and perhaps qualified younger individuals do not run because they would not have anything else to do after two terms, whereas an elected official can sometime keep a business running so they have something to do after his term(s) is up. Stan stated if term limits are continued at a local level, we will continue to get older individuals in elected positions. Responding to whether elected officials should be appointed, Stan stated the business of assessing real and taxable personal property is so close to grass roots and close to the people,that his opinion is the Assessor should be directly responsible to those people; he does not feel there should be a"Boss" between that official and the people being taxed. Stan stated he sees himself as County Assessor as a representative of all taxpayers in the process of assessing values to make sure it is fair, equitable,and timely. He further stated his job is to ensure the highest quality people are performing those functions, with him leading or overseeing the Charter Study Committee July 11, 2001, Page 2 process. Regarding qualifications or performance evaluations, Stan said the Department of Property Taxation provides ample guidance for performance. He stated he has no quarrel with the method of setting salaries for elected officials, and feels the County Council serves an excellent purpose; however, we are rapidly becoming an urban county, and they should make sure our salaries keep pace with state legislators salary structure in non-home rule counties for the same offices. Regarding county employees seeking elected office, he said we spend a lot of time and resources training people in the office, pushing management team into programs such as Leadership Weld County, with technical and computer needs; therefore, it would not make sense to take the trained deputy and tell him he cannot run for office without quitting for a year, and the County would stand to lose highly qualified people to run for office if they have to quit jobs for a year. He does feel employees should not be allowed to run against an incumbent; however, term limits opens that up every other election. Responding to Wade, Stan said his qualifications when he ran for elections was that of a licensed real estate broker who owned and operated a fairly large real estate company throughout the 80's, was a top producer in that office, and had been in the business for a long time. He stated during his campaign, his espoused weakness was his lack of knowledge in oil and gas appraisals, however, his management skills have proven to be the most valuable. He said the people were there, but not the leadership. He said with over 130,000 parcels to deal with, a background in appraising real property is a necessity. Responding to Wade, Stan stated the Assessor can, in fact, get training on the job, since all course work is available through the Department of Property Taxation. He indicated the Director of the Department is charged with making sure Assessors without training do somehow get training. Stan, however, stated he feels the qualifications for Deputy Assessor have more meaning, since he is the glue that sticks it all together; he has made it a career and the elected official cannot do the work himself, mainly providing the proper management model to have the work performed. Stan also stated as we become more urbanized it will be more that way; and stated there should definitely be qualifications for the deputy, which can be determined by the elected official. Responding to Dwaine about balancing the political side, Stan stated he is unsure of who would determine qualifications and standards. Regarding term limits, Stan agreed with Bill Hopkins that his job is almost managerial job, not having anything to do with setting public policy, but with carrying out legislative policy. He stated he does not feel pressures, such as a large corporation trying to put pressure on him by going through the Board of County Commissioners. He, too, feels the youngest, brightest, most technologically savvy people will be run off with term limits, and that there will always be a problem with turnover in elected officials, regardless of whether they are elected or appointed. Responding to Jackie, Stan stated the difference in political influence from the Board of County Commissioners and the voters is that although the Board can pressure, he can respond however he desires, however, if his job is at stake because of being appointed and he does not respond to the direction of the Board or manager, he would want to find ways to appease that individual. Responding to Bill Garcia, Stan stated he feels it is a combination of term limits, pay scale and some apathy playing a part in the younger candidates running for office, although term limits has the biggest effect, being that if the official gains office at 32 years old he would be out of a job at 40. Scott Anthony, Coroner, stated he will focus only on the Coroner's office which he feels is one of the most misunderstood offices, since the coroner is a law enforcement official. He said by State statute the Coroner is a Level III Peace Officer; it is an investigative agency;and the Coroner must understand the criminal justice process and law enforcement procedures; there is a lot of liability associated with the office; and it also acts as a checks and balance for other law enforcement Charter Study Committee July 11, 2001, Page 3 offices in the County. He said the Coroner should be elected, not appointed, and the Coroner needs to have full autonomy in his investigation. Regarding term limits, Scott said he was 31 when elected and will, therefore, be out of a job at 39. He stated he ran because he knew he could make a difference in the office and it has been a wonderful civics lesson for him. He feels he is probably young enough to find another job, and noted he is the first full time Coroner; before him the Coroners were paid by body count, then in 1994, the County Council made the position full time. Scott said he does not like term limits; most voters thought they would only affect the state level, and did not know it would also affect officials on a county level. Scott said he does not set policy, he follows policy; he would continue running for Coroner, although in this day it is a highly technical job; the Coroner's office is a full investigative agency; being Coroner is a full time career and should remain so. Regarding qualifications, Scott said he did not work in the office prior to running, however, he has become qualified on the job, and the State makes sure training is available and used. He said besides the State certification, he also requires National certification for his deputies. He reiterated it is forensic science, and in a"suit happy"environment, but he feels he must make sure there is no appearance of anything but the facts. The Legislature sets salaries, and Weld County's should stay in line with that, although it is much more equitable today than it was in the past. He said this is not a 9 to 5 office, it is 24 hours a day. Regarding employment status of those running for office, he said he does not agree that someone running against the incumbent be allowed to work in the office since it erodes the morale in the office; although someone with four years of experience should not be discounted just because they work in the office. Responding to Wade, Scott stated he had very little qualifications for the job, but it acted as an on- the-job training school. Scott said his own personal medical training is limited to having worked in a lab, with anatomy and physiology classes. He contracts a pathologist when needed. Scott reiterated for Wade that there are no medical doctors or pathologists on staff, it is all done by contract. Scott said he has four contracts with NCMC and two with McGee. Responding further to Wade, Scott stated he has not had problems with any forensic experts, except one particular pathologist; they have wonderful working relationships and are in constant daily communication. Scott stated if there is a difference of opinion, the Coroner retains the ultimate decision making determination; it is his responsibility to determine and rule on the cause of death. Statute specifically says he must inquire and be accurate. Responding to further questions from Wade Scott explained the contracts are paid through the Coroner's budget, under professional services, and for the year 2000, cost approximately $115,000 - $120,000. Responding to questions from Bill Garcia, Scott said in order for the Coroner to be elected, he is subject to term limits; however, if appointed, there may be conflicts of interest where the office should act as a checks and balance system; and the Coroner should make his decisions solely based on experience and skill without other pressures brought to bear if someone of importance within the community might be involved in an incident. Responding to Dwaine regarding his national certification, Scott explained it takes 6 - 8 years to become nationally certified. Scott explained the Colorado certification can be achieved within one year of being elected to office; however, national certification requires 4,000 class hours. Dwaine asked all elected officials to stop placing their integrity over political influence above the integrity of County employees and he does not like claims from elected officials that they have more integrity than employees of this County. Art Willis,Treasurer,stated the Charter defines internal operations of the entity,and this committee must review and recommend changes. He depicted the Charter as an image of the constitution Charter Study Committee July 11, 2001, Page 4 in microcosm; diverse populations are represented; we derive social and political strengths on those diversities. He indicated this committee was appointed by Republicans, the committee is Republican, he is Republican, and Weld County, by a few percentage points, also is Republican. Art stated creating or carrying out public policy should be by public choice, not by a single party board consisting of five members. Quoting a survey taken by the International Association of Accredited Clerks and Recorders, Elected Officials and Treasurers (IAACREOT), he stated the public wants these offices elected, instead of appointed; and he feels it is an insult to the intelligence of the voters to suggest only Commissioners should be elected. Regarding term limits, Art stated there is no reason to stick to term limits unless voters cannot be trusted. He said unless the incumbent is running, there is no reason to require employees to take a leave of absence to run for the vacancy, and current policy does not make sense, since the best qualified individual may be an employee. Art stated he has no quarrel with the Charter per se, although it was written years ago and could use a few refinements. He asked the committee to consider it only in light of protecting the rights of citizens. Wade, for the record, stated he is a democrat. Doug Rademacher, County Council said he is neither for or against term limits;whether an official is elected or appointed,there could be job descriptions, etc., but that might take away the voice of the people. Having salaries set by the County Council is a good method, and he hopes to alleviate some of the conservatism in the past. Regarding qualifications he stated since you do not need a diploma to run for President of the United Stated, it makes it difficult to require specific qualifications for local offices. Suki Tsukamoto, Clerk and Recorder, did not have comments. Al Dominguez, District Attorney, said he is a State elected official; however, he will still offer his opinion. Regarding term limits, he said he personally has been against them all his life; he thought the process was that every four years he had to prove he did a good job, that it was his duty to show he had done a good job to stay there every four years. Al said it has taken 12 years to gather the expertise he has now; although it took two years to know what the office was all about. Regarding officials being appointed vs elected, he said he has a real problem with the Sheriff and Coroner being appointed, and stated this is the first time the Weld County Coroner's Office has been professionally operated. He said the better the pay,the more qualified people will come and if the decision would to be appoint, salaries would have to be raised to attract qualified individuals. Al also stated adding wording to state anyone working for the County should not campaign on County time makes more sense than making employees go on a leave of absence to run for office. Responding to Dwaine,Al stated someone without a law degree could absolutely not run the office, and if it became an appointed position, qualifications would have to be set. Al stated if the office remains elected, only a few qualifications should be set, then if the elected official does not make themselves competent the voters will oust them. Al stated the only qualification for D.A.at this time is a law license or five years experience; and he reiterated it is incumbent upon the citizens to get an official out if he is not doing a good job. Al said it is the elected officials responsibility to show competence; and the citizens responsibility to know whether they are doing so. Al stated he is strongly against the Sheriff and Coroner being appointed,since they are law enforcement officials. Chuck stated this whole issue was discussed full length when the Charter was put together. Term limits were not wanted,so if a qualified person was in, the voters could keep them in and it was the decision of the voters. Responding to Wade, Al stated voter apathy is one of his personal hot Charter Study Committee July 11, 2001, Page 5 spots, and he thinks when people get what they deserve, they will then get on their wagons and get something done. Responding to Chuck, Al said regarding a referendum requiring 5 percent of the voters, Al said strict procedures are needed before citizens can change laws. Responding to Bill Garcia, Al said State law applies to the D.A., and it will be 2002 before voters decide about term limits for D.A.'s. He said it took 18 years to build his practice; therefore, he would never have run if he knew it would only be for eight years. He wanted to be a prosecutor, he was changing his career, and he was willing to gamble that he could prove to the citizens he was doing a good job. Al said his office should not be appointed, the individual should be free to act without pressures. Responding to Mark Gray, Al stated he agrees someone who is in office for eight years, is bringing up the quality of the office through experience, although only in some cases. He reiterated he is willing to gamble on the elected process. Jackie stated if the committee agrees, they will take public testimony on July 25, 2001. The committee agreed to hear one individual from out of town who will not be able to attend at that time. Aaron Sanchez stated he was raised in Greeley, and has been an FBI agent for 24 years as an administrator. He indicated he spoke with many Police Chiefs, over a ten-year period and accumulated much data. He stated he mainly learned Police Chiefs do not last because they had two masters. He said the possibility of the Sheriff becoming appointed saddens him, and leads to the one who appoints leaning on the appointee. After discussion, Jackie stated on July 25, 2001, one hearing will be held in Greeley with Bill Hopkins, Jackie, and Bill Garcia attending; on July 25, 2001, one hearing will be held in Firestone with Wade, Mark, and Don attending; and on July 23, 2001, one will be held in Briggsdale with Chuck and Dwaine. The time for all meetings is 7:00 p.m. Bruce stated staff can be available, however, staff should not give comments which only some would hear. He said we can tape the meetings. Jackie asked staff to prepare a summary of the issues, and reiterated the committee should only take public comments; however, she would like staff there if technical issues. She also clarified on July 18, 2001,the committee will revisit all issues,to see if the committee can come to decisions about recommendations on those items that went through subcommittee meetings. The meeting was adjourned at 9:15 p.m. Carol A. Harding Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee July 11, 2001, Page 6 HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES July 18, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Wade Carlson Don Cummins Bill Hopkins Jackie Johnson Dwaine Kurtz MEMBERS ABSENT: Bill Garcia Mark Gray ALSO PRESENT: Don Warden, Director, Finance and Administration Bruce Barker, County Attorney Lee Morrison, Assistant County Attorney Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Chair Jackie Johnson called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m.and distributed a letter received from Gilbert Evans. She asked that the committee review each issue that has been discussed thus far and determine the final decision of the committee on each issue. Lee Morrison, reviewed the timeline for two readings of ordinances instead of three, and stated to include language on all ordinances or resolutions does not require a Charter amendment. Don stated there is no reason to change if there is no real advantage either in time or cost. Bruce Barker stated there are sometimes technical changes on third reading which are of benefit; however, not many changes are done then. Consensus of the committee was to recommend no change concerning the reading of ordinances; however, it should be noted that it was considered. Responding to a question from Bill,the committee discussed what method is to be used regarding the committee recommendation when all are not in agreement. After discussion, it was decided that the majority of those present should agree,with an opportunity of those in minority to state why they are opposed. Regarding issue #7, Lee reviewed how the Election Code evolved over time and changes were made periodically, which the Charter has remained basically the same with only a few changes. He said we have been using the Election Code when the Charter was lacking in an area, and the committee discussed the differences. Lee also further discussed the issue of the number of signatures required on a petition to amend the Charter, which by statute is five percent of the registered electors; however, at present the Charter requires five percent of the votes cast in the last general election. Since it is not specified,the Clerk and Recorder typically uses the total votes cast on whichever item on the ballot had the most votes. Dwaine suggested the term"as provided by State statute"which could be used in some areas. Lee stated in this case the change would return to what the statute was when the Charter was approved; however, Jackie stated it might be better change it so that as the statutes continue to evolve, the Charter is in accordance with it. After further discussion, Bruce stated the Charter is given to those individuals wishing to initiate a petition for a checklist of things to do, therefore, if it refers back to the statutes it simplifies the process. Lee stated the problem is we did not follow the statute at startup and, if we come into compliance now, and the statute changes later, we would not have to. Bill emphasized he does not want to put any initiative process in jeopardy. Jackie restated the issue, which is the recommendation of the committee, to change to suggested language to require five percent of registered electors in Weld County, and housekeeping changes in this section to use "registered electors"throughout,as well as whatever terms are necessary in the Charter to match the Election Code. Regarding issue#8,Bruce reviewed the question of whether an initiated amendment to the Charter should be used to determine certain land uses in the County, and stated the proposed change would eliminate the possibility of the Charter being used to determine land use cases. He questioned if it were on the ballot and turned down whether that would send a message to an enterprising attorney that it is possible on any land use case because the electorate turned down the change,therefore indicating they want to use initiatives in this manner. He also discussed the difficulty of expressing to the electorate what you are trying to accomplish with the change and indicated the change to five percent of the registered electorate discussed earlier will make a big difference in this case also. Mr. Barker indicated the one time this was used, it was after a small general election so the numbers of signors was relatively small, and stated the subcommittee recommend no change here. Jackie pooled the members and stated the recommendation will be to not make a change in this area. Regarding issue#9 Bruce stated he believes the County Council would notify the official when it was being considered, although this makes the notification formal; and he further stated the additional language being proposed would be an automatic reinstatement for an official found to be not guilty instead of having to wait for the County Council to meet and take action on his reinstatement. Bill pointed out this section does not have consistent language, since the terms "official" and "officer are intermixed throughout the section; however, after discussion it was decided not to recommend that change. Bruce discussed the differences in"crime"(as used in the Charter) versus "felony or infamous crime" (as used in State statutes), and stated he would recommend against any change, pointing out the Charter is more strict. After further discussion among the members,Jackie stated the recommendation is to change those areas dealing with due process and the reinstatement language as proposed; however, not to recommend other changes to this section. After discussion regarding issue #10, the committee will recommend the proposed language to make redistricting mandatory after each federal census, which allows more frequent redistricting but requires one every ten years. Regarding issue #11 and after discussion, Jackie determined the committee recommendation would be do delete this section which is an out of date provision as a housekeeping measure. Regarding the E-mail received from John Folsom, Dwaine stated he did notify Mr. Folsom it had been forwarded to the committee for review, and reviewed the history of its inception which goes back to a recent election when several Commissioners carried petitions for County Council nominations. Mr. Folsom felt that was a conflict of interest which should be eliminated by adding language to prohibit any"county officer, member of appointed board or commission, or employee of Weld County"from circulating petitions. During discussion, Bruce stated employees are already prohibited from campaigning during County time through the Personnel Policy; and there is no requirement in the Charter that employees have to work from 8:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m., only that the Charter Study Committee July 18, 2001, Page 2 County be the primary employer. Wade stated the changes suggested by Mr. Folsom are too closely involved with First Amendment rights; and Bruce, responding to Bill, explained the Board of County Commissioners creates Personnel Policies,and those policies currently state the elected official sets working hours, therefore, employees know when they should be working. An elected official; however, does not know specific working hours. Don pointed out the Sheriff, by statute, must be"at the command of the people at all times." After polling the members, Jackie stated the recommendation will be for no change. Jackie indicated she would like to discuss setting of salaries and filing of vacancies in elected officials by the County Council when Bill is here since he had some questions regarding this. Recapping issue #5, Bruce explained it is seen as a burden to an employee who is running for elective office to have to go on leave without pay during the nine months after he announces his candidacy, and reviewed the case law he has found which indicate it may be a violation of First Amendment Rights to run. Discussion centered on: 1)limiting the leave requirement to employees running for partisan offices in Weld County, 2) limiting it to only if the employee is working in the same office for which he is running; 3) change the requirement to require leave after the primary, and 4)change the requirement to exempt offices if not running against an incumbent. Jackie noted the elected officials were against making any changes to this section, and stated it causes too much friction in the office. Bill stated it is the responsibility of the elected official to deal with misbehavior in his office, it is not the responsibility of this committee to define or mediate employment conflict. After further discussion, the committee decided to recommend elimination of the second sentence of section 4-2(B)(2)(f)altogether; and Dwaine stated the minority opinion is it should be amended to require the leave of absence only after the primary is won. Jackie suggested since issues #1 through #4 are interrelated, with Bill having several issues he wanted to discuss, the committee save these items until Bill is present. After discussion about the public input meetings scheduled for next week, the committee agreed to have staff prepare a summary of all eleven items to show what all the committee has been reviewing, since it gives credibility to the committee and may also serve as an education to people as to why these issues need to be considered. Jackie adjourned the meeting at 8:55 p.m. '&14, Carol A. Har ing Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee July 18, 2001, Page 3 s HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES Briggsdale School Gymnasium July 23, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Dwaine Kurtz ALSO PRESENT: Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Chuck Carlson called the meeting to order at 7:10 p.m. and read the list of issues. During the discussion on term limits for elected officials, Doris Williams stated the County Commissioners do not have to be professional; however, the Sheriff, Treasurer, and Assessor need to be professional. She stated the County Commissioners could be paid on a daily basis, since they are not needed every day. She stated a County Manager could be beneficial,along with the Finance Director, with the County Commissioners being nonpartisan and elected. George Baxter stated over half the counties in Colorado have opted out of term limits for at least some officials; in policy positions, term limits are more important, and the County Commissioners set policy for the overall County,whereas no other official does; he has no problem with term limits for County Commissioners since they are the policy-setting board; and Commissioners cannot be elected on an as-needed basis, it must be left full-time because of the number of things that come up, the number of meetings, and the impossibility of knowing how you would ever figure out when to be there or have office hours. Betty Ehn questioned what procedure would be used to remove term limits She feels term limits are intended for County Commissioners. Margie Martinez stated term limits takes away the vote of the people and an official coming into an office for eight years cannot make many changes, since people do not change quickly, and procedures cannot be changed overnight. She also said it takes quite awhile to figure out what needs to be changed. Discussing election or appointment of County officials, Ms. Ehn stated the allegiance of the official would be to the Board who appointed them rather than the public. She stated a nonpartisan board of Commissioners would be more effective. Responding to Chuck,Ms. Ehn stated the Greeley City Council is nonpartisan, the members run as individuals, but not with party backing. Chuck stated Scott Anthony is a good example for eliminating term limits, he made changes in the office that were needed,and the County will be losing someone of high quality when he cannot run again. Ms. Martinez agreed that is an example of someone who was paid on an as-needed basis, moving the office from "rural county" to the more "urban county" level, with huge changes in approximately eight years; however, Dwaine stated the changes could have been made by an appointed official as well. He wondered if there is a grass roots relationship with planning and zoning that it should have more people elected. Mr. Baxter stated if term limits are eliminated there will still be elected officials; if the Charter does away with elected officials, or appoints more it would be putting a whole lot of authority into those five people to appoint all those officials. With Planning and Zoning, however, a high level of decisions are already made at the County Commissioner level for many land use matters, and there are a certain amount of checks and balances between elected officials, which should be left in place. In a discussion regarding setting of salaries and filling of vacancies by the County Council, Dwaine stated the option would be to revert to State Statutes. Ms. Ehn said she would hate to see patronage come back in, but it is party politics when you come down to it. She would recommend a vacancy committee having input into the appointment. Mr. Baxter pointed out that if you take those two duties away from the County Council, there would not be much left for them to do, so why have a County Council. He said it still comes back to who you elect in those positions, and Ms. Williams said a good County Council is worth its weight in gold. Regarding qualifications for elected officials, Ms. Williams suggested adding "as defined by statute,"and said term limits is the only thing that should be on the ballot. Dwaine questioned what qualifications could be set for Coroner, which is the only official in the County besides the Sheriff who has arrest authority, but he also overrides the Sheriff in cases of death. Ms. Ehn asked what qualified individual would be found for a salary of $52,000 a year. Mr. Baxter said it would be difficult to know who sets qualifications and how you would decide which qualifications to set. In discussion on employees being required to take a leave of absence, Ms. Martinez stated it is an unfair opportunity for one who is not a public employee since no one else has to go nine months without a salary in order to run. She said it creates unfaimess and we lose the most highly qualified employees,and stated employees cannot campaign during office hours in any case. Ms. Martinez said to try to control backstabbing and fighting within the office by changing the Charter is like legislating parental authority, it cannot be done. She stated her preference is to do away with this portion completely,the elected official should have control of his office;although she could live with changing to primary. Mr. Baxter questioned where you draw the line,at the primary election or the November election. He stated most people running would say I am going to quit and campaign, although he understands it puts a hardship on employee. Mr. Baxter pointed out you are an official candidate even if you only receive one vote in the primary but are unopposed. Ms. Williams said moving it to the Primary makes more sense,just because you are announcing you should not have to quit that soon; and Ms. Ehn said a candidate cannot limit meetings, and some will run into work time. Regarding the Election Code, Ms. Martinez stated it is too easy to put initiatives on the ballot when you can hire people to collect signatures,you have missed the whole purpose of the initiative. The consensus of those present said this change is okay, as well as adding due process for the suspension of an elected official charged with a crime. Those present felt mandatory redistricting should be done, and the service district changes have no overall effect on the County. Ms. Martinez submitted written comments from Bob Lowe. The meeting was adjoumed at 8:30 p.m. 4/4,49-, Carol A. Harding Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee July 23, 2001, Page 2 HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES Frederick/Firestone Fire Station July 25, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Wade Carlson Don Cummins MEMBERS ABSENT: Mark Gray ALSO PRESENT: Esther Gesick, Acting Clerk to the Board Wade Carlson called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m. There being no public present,the meeting was adjourned at 7:15. Esther E. Gesick Acting Clerk to the Board HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES Greeley Public Input July 25, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Bill Garcia Bill Hopkins ALSO PRESENT: Don Warden, Director, Finance and Administration Lee Morrison, Assistant County Attorney Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Bill Hopkins called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m., and stated there was also a public hearing in Briggsdale on Monday and one in Firestone tonight. He said the committee members are here to take public input regarding any information regarding the Charter, and the full committee will debate all issues brought forth. Shirley Smith provided a printed copy of her remarks and states she is opposed to Home Rule, which she sees as rewriting State statutes to suit local officials. She stated accountability must be provided through the State. A copy of Charter was provided to her. Carol Burkhart stated she worked as Secretary for the Board of County Commissioners when the Charter was being implemented. She is opposed to any term limit that is not voted upon by local voters. She feels the electors should have an opportunity to vote on the elimination of term limits for individual elected officials and that they should be voted on separately, not grouped together into one vote, since she feels the electors might want them eliminated in sine areas where higher technical expertise or longer learning curve are necessary. Regarding #10 she stated the possibility of boundary changes every two years makes running for Commissioner Districts "iffy" and felt if the Charter is amended to make redistricting mandatory following the census, the amendment should delete, or require, any other reviews. Regarding the second issue raised by a member of the public, she stated if this is recommended, the committee should delete the appointed board or commission member, since they are not paid or employed by Weld County. On issue #5 she stated she recognizes the difficulties in the office, particularly if there is an incumbent seeking reelection;although,to require leave of absence to run for any office goes well beyond what is reasonable,and should at least be amended to"if you are seeking the office of your immediate supervisor." Do not tell others they cannot run. Responding to Chuck, Carol stated whether the requirement is for the primary or all the way through to election day does not make a difference, since you might be in the primary against you boss, therefore, if you win it would eliminated the problem. She stated she does not see any difference in the timing; however, it gives the incumbent the edge, and the employee loses his job. She stated if the employee is running in another office, he should not have to quit. She stated if the reason for change is potential of mischief or simple conflict that might be created in the office, no one should campaign during office hours in any case, and any employee should not have to quit to run for office. Responding to Bill Garcia, Ms. Burkhart stated she would distinguish the County Commissioners to be an administrative, quasi-judicial, policy making board and, therefore, the most appropriate for term limits (if she were for term limits). Officials such as the Coroner, Treasurer, and Assessor, are more administrative than policy making, should not be hindered by term limits. She stated the Clerk and Recorder is more administrative, however, she holds a very broad role when one looks at all functions of her office. She said although the Sheriff does not make policy, he is elected to carry out the law,the way he distributes and focuses resources makes his more of a policy-making function. Ms. Burkhart reiterated she would like to see all offices come up for a vote, including the Board of County Commissioners, and each one voted on separately. Clearly understand the differences between the two. People need the opportunity to vote yes or no for each official. Merle and Karla Grieser were present, and Karla presented a prepared statement, advocating keeping the selection of county officials in the hands of voters, thereby making them accountable only to the people who voted for them. Ms. Grieser stated the voters do have intelligence to determine who officials should be, and the committee was wise to ask for the elected officials opinions. Regarding requiring leave of absence to run for office, Ms. Grieser stated it is placing an unfair financial burden on each candidate and is jeopardizing their career. She stated term limits were not voted in to include County offices, and the electorate should determine every four years, also, she agrees the officials should be separated when it is on the ballot. She said she does not agree with term limits and felt the electorate was voting more for the national offices than local,and the intent of that legislation was for national, rather than local offices. Responding to Bill Garcia regarding the County Council filling vacancies of elected officials, Ms. Grieser stated the political party vacancy committee should be a part of the process. Responding to Chuck regarding item#7, Ms. Grieser stated the process needs to be more difficult, therefore it should require five percent of registered voters. Responding to the same question, Ms. Burkhart stated because of small tumout of voters in some elections, she questions whether five percent of those cast in the last election is large enough, however, she is hesitant to go with registered electors totally when voters remain registered up to six years after death or being a resident, college voters who have left the area are still registered, and the voter registration list is not purged frequently. She suggested a higher percentage of last votes cast instead of five percent, and stated she does not like to see things go on the ballot too easily by petition; however, we need to find a good medium. Virginia Foos stated she disagrees with some term limits. She said, if elected, the official should have the right to stay, other than the County Commissioners. She also stated she thinks the County Council and County Attorney should be elected and should also have term limits with the Board of County Commissioners. Ms. Foos stated the Board of County Commissioners should make people aware that they are the Board of Directors of Social Services,and stated she has had problems with the County Attomey regarding the Children's Code. She stated she realizes this is not part of the Charter; however, it should be better known that the Board of Directors of Social Services is the Board of County Commissioners. Ms. Foos stated she personally would eliminate the Home Rule Charter, and she feels the Council needs to adjust salaries to meet the growth in the County. She said perhaps a personal property tax could build revenue to help fund those salary increases, so home owners do not foot the entire bill. Ms. Foos stated the Sheriff, and District Attorney should not be term limited;however,County Council,County Commissioners,and County Attomey should all have term limits. She feels Judges should have term limits and be elected instead of appointed. She stated she is opposed to Home Rule which allows too many laws to be made by one group of people, and she advocates more effective voter education. Ruth Gartrell stated term limits on County Commissioners should remain; she will vote against appointing other officers; and term limits should be voted upon to remove from other County officials. She said it is unfair to ask County employees to quit their jobs if running for a job outside Charter Study Committee July 25, 2001, Page 2 his own department; however, she understands it if the employee is running for his own department, except when no incumbent is running. Ms. Gartrell said there is no reason to quit after the primary;the employee should not be running in the same department as working in which creates too much mischief; appointed board members should not be prohibited from working on elections;there should not be redistricting between census counts; and she believe in the Charter. Responding to Chuck,Ms.Burkhart stated regarding#8 there are too many problems to mess with, and it is better to leave it alone. Bill Hawkins pointed out the committee has not yet decided what will go forward. Mr. Morrison explained if a group uses the ability in Weld County to have a Charter amendment and combine it with the State vested rights law, it creates a window of opportunity that the developer can take advantage of, noting approval is not final until the appeal is decided. He said in the past case, the County was not protected in vested rights law, and ended up paying approximately one-half million dollars. Mr. Morrison also clarified redistricting, and said the State also allows review every two years, so the County can change it and limit it to ten years, however, if just accepting the same thing we should just to the State statutes. The Charter need to have language if redistricting is needed more frequently than every ten years. Bill Hawkins adjourned the meeting at 8:20 p.m. Carol A. Harding Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee July 25, 2001, Page 3 HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES August 1, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Wade Carlson Bill Garcia Bill Hopkins Jackie Johnson Dwaine Kurtz MEMBERS ABSENT: Don Cummins Mark Gray ALSO PRESENT: Don Warden, Director, Finance and Administration Bruce Barker, County Attorney Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Chair Jackie Johnson called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m. Bruce Barker reviewed his memo to Jackie Johnson, summarizing the status of each issue that has been discussed by the committee, and gave the members copies of specific changes that need to be determined when decided upon issues #1 through 5, as well as changes submitted by Lee Morrison of the specific language changes for amending the Charter to match the Colorado Election Code in references dealing with "electors." Bruce explained if the committee desires to place the question of term limits on the ballot, subsection (3) could be added to Section 6-4 stating, "Except for the elected offices of County Commissioner and County Councilman,any elected officer may serve more than two full consecutive terms." He reviewed the list of offices which are listed as elective in Section 6-1, and provided, on pages 3 and 4, the current Charter and State statute language regarding filling of vacancies and setting salaries of elected offices. Bruce also reviewed, on page 6, the current Charter language regarding qualification of elective officers, as well as the State statute change which was added in 1997 dealing with qualifications for Sheriff, and the qualifications for Coroner and appraisers in the assessor's office. He also noted there are no current qualifications listed for Treasurer or Clerk and Recorder or their employees. Bruce stated the last page in his handout gives the current language in the Charter regarding leave without pay for employees running for partisan office. Jackie polled the committee to see if anyone had second thoughts on any of the issues except#1 through#5; however,there were no objections to accepting them as stated in Bruce's memo. She suggested a general discussion of the overall issue of elected versus appointed official, since items#1 through#5 are all tied into that one issue. Wade stated that no one he spoke to wanted elected officials to change, everyone wanted to vote on all of them, and he stated the citizens look at the election of local officials as a basic right of freedom which should remain. He said that, as far as those who are not currently elected, such as the County Attorney, it is a very personal decision,to the Board who must work with them, therefore, it should not be elected. He said most people believe the current way is fine when discussing other County officials, taking an attitude of "If it's not broke, don't fix it." He said he believes people want to vote on those people who are in decision-making positions, and are willing to have appointments continue for those considered to be staff people. Bill Garcia stated he agrees with Wade and said he did not hear a lot of people say they wanted appointments,only a few wanted a one or two appointed. He said he heard appointing for Coroner suggested, and remembered Carol Burkhart questioning where one would draw the line between who to elect and who to appoint. Bill said he agrees with her breakdown between legislative, judicial, or executive power, with the more bureaucratic being on one side and the quasi-judicial on another side, with the quasi-judicial side not being appointed. Therefore, since he sees the Board of County Commissioners as legislative,it would not be appropriate for appointment. Neither would the County Council or Sheriff. When it comes to the Assessor, Treasurer, and Clerk and Recorder, Bill asked what the benefit would be either to elect or to appoint and stated the Assessor deals with tax money, making it critical to elect; the Clerk and Recorder has a lot of public interaction, therefore, public accountability is very appropriate; the Treasurer handles money for the county and, in event people do not like what is being done with funds, they people can have their voice heard most strongly in dealings with funds; the Coroner might be appropriate for appointment, however, he was swayed by the elected officials comments regarding this office,and now feels the Coroner, as well as all officials, should be elected. Chuck stated he talked to farm organizations, church members, the Chamber of Commerce, citizens he ran into and there was only one who took exception to electing. That one said maybe appoint the Treasurer,Assessor, and Clerk, however,the Sheriff and Coroner should definitely be elected. He said he talked to a lot of people, and most want officials to remain as elected officials. He also stated a lot of people think we have a County Manager and they think he should be elected, also. Wade said a few people mentioned recall, stating they would want that option to remain. Responding to Dwaine, Bruce stated none of the changes being discussed would have an impact on recalls. He said Issue #7 deals only with amendments to the Charter, and he stated eligible electors is the proper term, not qualified or registered to vote. Dwaine stated the overriding concept appears to be what would make a good government. His personal opinion,as well as that as an elected official who hears more than others at times, is to keep it at a grass roots level. He feels if a grass roots issue is desired, one should look at Planning and Zoning, and stated if one is advocating"let the electorate speak"from a grass roots level, he is surprised no one has looked at that area. He said the committee should also look at what chance voters have to reconcile their own understanding. For instance, the Assessor cannot make unilateral decisions, there is an appeal process and the State Department of Property Taxation; and the Sheriff and District Attorney have the Courts minding their business. However, the Treasurer is without checks and balances;his banking and investment procedures are not checked;audits and financial reports are required, but if his reports do not meet the needs of the Commissioners, there are no options for correction. Dwaine stated the Coroner also has no checks and balances, either, and pointed out the Coroner can overrule the District Attorney and the Sheriff and, after six and one-half years in office, he is working on his national certification. Dwaine said at a minimum, the candidates need to qualify themselves. He said he would like to pull out the Treasurer and Coroner and look very closely at them because they are the ones without other bodies reviewing them. He said he supports the Assessor, Clerk and Recorder, and Sheriff for elected offices. Bill Hawkins stated he has not heard a groundswell of public demand for appointments instead of appointments. He said he heard a good discussion with pros and cons, although some of the comments that were heard indicated several individual had little or no knowledge of how government works and what effects decisions have. He said voter apathy is getting worse, and Charter Study Committee August 1, 2001, Page 2 discussed reserving the right of the people to make these decisions, stating he feels conflict between letting the people do it, if people can make intelligent decisions, although that does not happen. He said hee thinks it is unreasonable to say it is an American right to elect everything we can, and noted the public does not necessarily make that happen. He said there is no reason for the Coroner to be elected,allowing a person to come into office with little or no forensic experience, he would rather have someone to come to that job who is already fully qualified,and will get better as the term goes along, not someone coming into office to learn what is necessary as time goes by. He does not feel we need those gaps in the performance of public officials. Bill stated he is in favor of the Sheriff and Clerk and Recorder as being elected; however, after that, he does not see any that should be elective instead of appointed. He said most offices need credentials, not the most effective politician; and we should preserve what we can in the electors opportunity to have a say where it truly makes an impact, but where the job is administrative, non-policy making, with expertise required and where the learning curve can be shortened is where appointments should be made, including the Treasurer, Assessor, and Coroner. Jackie questioned what the distinction is to make the Treasurer and Coroner more administrative, and stated she would like to put each one on the ballot. Bill Hawkins said he can see the point of putting each one on the ballot, if electors are the ones which make the best decisions, let them speak. He also said he may have been too quick including the Clerk and Recorder in those he thinks should be elected; however, he included her because of his own interactions with the Elections Department. He said he could comfortably put the Clerk and Recorder into the appointed group and feel good about it. In further discussion, Bill said regarding the Sheriff, he would like a more direct voice in who is taking care of his personal safety, rather than who is lowering the gavel on his taxes or how long he has to stand in line to get license plates. He feels the law enforcement portion of our lives is terribly important, and citizens get comfort knowing it is well done and resources are managed well, and they want a voice in that. He said after that, it does not make a lot of difference. He would rather focus the electors time and energy on the Commissioner's level and elect good Commissioners and Sheriff and the rest will be handled correctly. If they are not handled correctly, those few officials will not be re-elected. He does not feel the electors want to deal with learning about qualifications for County Manager, etc., and that if there are good Commissioners,you have good government; if they are lousy,so is the govemment. He stated the committee should vest the power, authority, and responsibility with the highest possible level and the fewest individuals, and let good government rule. Responding to Jackie,who asked whether the County is required to have a Coroner, Bruce stated we would have to have someone who covers those services, although it would not have to be a position and could be covered with contracted services. Dwaine said investigative functions would also have to be hired, as well as forensic, and Bruce said when the Sheriff is incapacitated, the Coroner has the authority to step in to do service of process and to cover several areas for the Sheriff. Bill Hawkins said he is against eliminating the office of Coroner, but Ed Jordan and Al Dominguez both spoke of the importance of the credibility of the Coroner, describing an effective partnership in managing some cases,and relationships that work well,all of which may not develop as well in the case of contracted personnel. Bill also discussed general accountability in County government,said whatever can be done through the process of qualifications, responsibilities,job descriptions; performance reviews, etc., offers more consistency, and he also said it is not necessarily the people's responsibility to say they are accountable to us every four years. He said there are a lot of quality long-term staff people, such as Bruce Barker and Don Warden,who have memory of actions, and that cannot be replaced by electing those people. Responding to Chuck, who questioned who will appoint those individuals, Bill Hawkins said there is a hiring process in the Personnel Manual for County employees,and the function of the Personnel Department is to assist Charter Study Committee August 1, 2001, Page 3 in the hiring process, deciding what the qualifications are,which credentials are needed,etc.,then sending the most highly qualified individuals to the Commissioners for the interview process and final decision. Chuck said he has talked to many people who are working on boards here in the County who understand this stuff; however,they all want elected officials instead of appointed. Jackie pointed out that he is sampling a terribly small portion of the public, and the committee has to use the best heads and determine what makes the most sense. She said the voters are going to decide these issues, and the committee needs to say which makes the most sense. She said Chuck's vision is that most people want to elect these officials; however, others feel heads and common sense say we need to appoint some, and put it on the ballot and let the people decide. Jackie said there was an obligation to hold public hearings; however,Bill Hawkins said there really was no consensus due to the small turnout and members of the committee should not be swayed by a small group who might or might not represent the voters. In further discussion,Wade said the structure of accountability comes back to the County Council, and Bill Hawkins said we have the structure, the question is whether it is complete and functional. Jackie said the Board of County Commissioners has no authority to exercise over the Treasurer, only the responsibility to fund through the budget process. She said the County Council role was that they have authority to order a performance audit of that office, but no real authority over them. Bruce said the only authority for the County Council after a performance audit is to report the results to the Board of County Commissioners. Dwaine stated the County Council goes to the appropriate person in response to each complaint received. Bill Hawkins said there seems to be limited accountability, and this committee needs a briefing on the authority in County government over the elected officials, and the accountability of those elected officials. Jackie said we should have Bruce or staff talk to us generally about the role of County Council, what type of checks and balances are in place, what authority the Council and the Board of County Commissioners have, how positions are currently appointed or hired by the Board of County Commissioners, how the job standards are developed,and what type of accountability is built into that system. Bill Hawkins also suggested how the elected officials are accountable and to whom they are accountable. After further discussion as to why the committee should consider appointments, Jackie reiterated she would be asking staff to report on how the whole appointive system would work. Bill Hawkins said there are good appointments all over the place and good elective officers; therefore, since both are possible, he asked where this committee should draw the line and say from here up are elected and here down are appointed, and determine whether to change that line. He said 25 years ago the electorate came up with a way to manage County government in an effective way, with a means (this committee)to review and see if there is a need to change it, allowing for ours to be a"living charter". Chuck noted there have been a lot of changes in State statutes which allow other counties to do what only Home Rule counties used to be able to do. Jackie stated the committee needs to decide this issue before the others are addressed since they are all somewhat related, and said she would prefer to hear from staff about the authority of the County Council, Board of County Commissioners as regards to elected officials,the overall hiring process, what staff would envision it to be if it were to be appointed or hired, what the current Category 1 salaries are, as well as County-set salaries, and the budgetary impact if officials were changed from elected to appointed. Don Warden stated if the elected official were appointed, he probably would not have a Chief Deputy; therefore, the two salaries could be combined into one without a big cost swing or savings going one way or the other. Charter Study Committee August 1, 2001, Page 4 Regarding scheduling the next meeting, Bruce said the Chair may ask the Board of County Commissioners to extend the deadline; however, the drop dead date for the Board of County Commissioners is September 10, 2001, and they will need an indication of what time is needed. After discussion, it was determined the next meeting should be August 9, 2001, at 7:00 p.m., with the 29'"as the goal to make all decisions. Jackie said we should have meetings on the 9th, 15th, and 29th. Bruce asked the committee to study Section 4-2 of the Charter, about setting up qualifications, how people are hired,etc.,as well as Section 13-8, regarding the powers and duties of the County Council, and noted the rest is mechanical. If the committee wants to change the method, the question is how to put it as a single issue on the ballot, and suggested it would need to be by each elected official. He said there will be a ripple effect of changes throughout the entire Charter, and, if a few are changed but not all, that will have to be accommodated in various other sections. Bruce and Lee will try to pick out other sections that will have a ripple effect. Jackie asked whether the ballot question could read,"Amend to provide for appointment of official X," and Bruce said he would study that and check with other cities, etc., to see how they have handled the ripple effect. The meeting was adjourned at 8:55 p.m. /a.A-et41:7// Carol A. Harding Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee August 1, 2001, Page 5 HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES August 15, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Wade Carlson Bill Garcia Bill Hopkins Jackie Johnson Dwaine Kurtz MEMBERS ABSENT: Mark Gray Don Cummins ALSO PRESENT: Don Warden, Director, Finance and Administration Bruce Barker, County Attorney Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Chair Jackie Johnson called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. Bruce Barker provided a handout of information and, from page 1, reviewed the issue of changing the terms "registered elector"or "eligible elector", and stated it would be very difficult to accomplish since it is used in the Charter too many times; however, he recommended changing the definition in Section 16-10 of"qualified elector"to read, "The term shall be equivalent to the term'registered elector'or'eligible elector'as defined in Statute according to the context in which they appear in this Charter." Reviewing pages 2, 3, and 4 of his handout, Bruce indicated the current language in the Charter outlining the duties of the Division of Personnel. Don Warden presented an outline of recruitment procedures for Department Head Positions from Pat Persichino, Personnel Director,and explained if elected officials were changed to appointive,this is the process that would be hired. Mr.Warden explained the County personnel system is a federal government approved merit system,and is not applicable to a political patronage type of position; and the individual is hired based on a competitive process for the selection. He said the steps are as follows: 1. Review and update job description, looking at the skill, knowledge, and ability required for the position. The Personnel Department would prepare the job description which the Board of County Commissioners would review. 2. Salary review to determine fair compensation, including use of salary surveys such as Mountain States Employer's Council and salary.com, to determine appropriate salary range. 3. Determine qualifications, education, years and kind of experience, and licensing requirements. 4. Recruit on a state-wide basis, as a minimum, although typically for a Department Head, nation-wide is more appropriate. National and professional publications would also be used to advertise, as well as the Denver Post or Rocky Mountain News. 5. Position would then be posted, usually for a minimum of six weeks, sometimes eight weeks. A certain closing date would be listed and no applications would be accepted after that date. 6. Review of resumes by the Personnel Department to ensure the qualifications are met, and ranking of top applicants. Don said the Board of County Commissioners sometimes looks at all applications that qualify, sometimes only the top ones. 7. Personnel Department and Board of County Commissioners meet to review applications, usually fiver or ten are preferred by everyone. They would cut the number down to five or seven, then schedule for interview. 8. Interview is held by Board of County Commissioners,at times with the use of an interview committee made up of a variety of individuals including staff members, Don, Bruce, someone with special expertise in the area, etc. The interview is completed from a prepared set of questions to provide faimess for the applicants; however,the committee can deviate from those questions if it is associated with the original question. 9. The Committee ranks applicants and determines best individual for job. 10. Personnel Director calls to offer job and negotiate start date, etc. 11. Upon acceptance, the individual is appointed by formal resolution. 12. If first choice declines the job for any reason, the committee meets again to ensure the second choice is the next one to ask. 13. Other applicants are not notified until the final applicant has accepted the job. Responding to Dwaine, Don explained the merit system does not discriminate; however,a political appointment, such as those made by Mayor Webb, does not have to fit into the merit system. He said certain positions can be exempt from the personnel system; however, with Social Services employees under our personnel system,we are required to have to have a merit system. Don said Chief Deputies, the Undersheriff, County Attorney and Assistant County Attorney's are exempted from the system. Bruce said Section 4-2.B.2.a, b, and c outline the basis of the County system; and #7 on page 4 lists those individuals not included within the system. Bruce also answered the question of whether appointed official means hired official. He said included in the definition of appointment is the'term of art'for an employee of an entity. He said the Charter uses the term appointment 40 or 50 times, and it makes the distinction between elected or appointed. Bruce also said the word"hire"is never used in the Charter, instead appointment is the word which is used. He said there are three categories of employees in Weld County: elected officials, employees who are under the Personnel merit system, and employees who are exempt from the Personnel merit system (these employees do not have grievance rights, and serve at the will of the elected official.) Bruce reiterated the Undersheriff and chief deputy of each elected official, temporary employees, advisors, and consultants retained by contract, and the County Attorney and Assistant County Attorneys fall into the third category. He also explained the District Attorney's staff is not subject to the Personnel merit system, they are employees of the District Attorney, although in Weld Charter Study Committee August 15, 2001, Page 2 County he has adopted all of the personnel system except the grievance procedure. Jackie clarified that if this committee were to recommend appointment of existing elected officials, it would need to include language as to whether or not that individual would be exempted from the Personnel system. Jim Gardner, former county council member, questioned length of terms if appointments were made. Jackie explained that,with a merit system based upon performance, the appointed official would fall under the Personnel system and would be subject to the same performance requirements as other employees. Bruce stated the decision would have to be made whether the position would be "at will" like the County Attorney, or an "employee" under the merit system like everyone else with grievance rights. Bill Garcia questioned what happens to the staff working under an elected position, if the elected position is changed to an appointment. Bruce stated we are required to have an Undersheriff, although the title can be different, someone has to be able to fill in for Sheriff;and he further stated the change could to do away with the chief deputy position. Responding to Dwaine, Don said there currently is not an equivalent position to chief deputy status in Departments of Planning and Zoning, Public Works, Health Department, etc., and added that anyone can be designated as chief deputy. For example, in the Sheriffs Office, Rick Dill is the second in charge and his title is Administrator,although John Cooke is designated the Undersheriff, but works as a manager under Rick Dill. Bruce recommended elimination of the chief deputy category if the elected official becomes appointed. Chuck said if the Board of County Commissioners is making the appointments, they will make a change in the position if they really want to, regardless of whether the official is doing a good job or not, although the other members of the committee felt it would not be easy to fire an individual because of the grievance procedures. Don pointed out the culture in Weld County allows for the politicalization of positions and the history has been that, even those appointed by prior boards, such as his position appointed by four democrats and one republican,although vulnerable to the Board's rejection,has remained through numerous boards. Wade pointed out the difficulty of terminating an employee, and Don said the Personnel system was not in place when the Charter was written. Chuck reiterated the individual's credibility will be in jeopardy if Board members decide they do not like him. Jackie suggested discussion about the authority over elected officials as it currently exists. Bruce stated the Charter provides no supervisory authority over the five elected officials (Assessor, Treasurer, Clerk and Recorder, Sheriff, and Coroner.) He said any authority would be indirect, such as, if an elected official resigned or died in office,the Board of Commissioners would appoint to fill the position until the next election. He said the Board sets the budget which gives them indirect authority,although they do not direct the day-to-day business matters of the offices. Bruce said under State law, when the property owner disputes the value set by the Assessor for his property, there is an appeal process to the Board of Commissioners, sitting as the Board of Equalization, thereby giving the Board indirect authority over valuations and assessments. Bruce also stated the Board of Assessment Appeals also would hear appeals, giving a higher level of authority over the subject matter of what the Assessor does. He stated the Clerk and Recorder has State oversight of Motor Vehicles and Elections;however,the Recording Division has no oversight, although the Clerk and Recorder sets the agenda by very strict standards pursuant to State statutes. Bruce said the other three, even though they have to abide by State statutes, have no oversight of their positions. He also said if the five elected officials are not treating an employee fairly,the employee can file a grievance,which includes an appeal process to the Board of County Commissioners. Responding to Bill Garcia, Bruce said the Board of Commissioners, upon appeal, can uphold or overturn the decision of the grievance board. Bruce further stated we have been tested in a prior case which went to the Court of Appeals, that an elected official cannot make employees serve at will. He said a grievance must be based on a disciplinary action against an Charter Study Committee August 15, 2001, Page 3 individual or policies have not been fairly or adequately followed. Responding to Wade, Bruce said a grievance can only be filed by an individual, no groups are allowed as the grieving party. Bill Hopkins asked whether employees of the County Clerk who went to the County Council to complain about conditions in the office had gone through the grievance process, and Bruce stated that type of complaint would not qualify as a grievance. Bill Garcia stated the primary oversight for all elected officials is the judicial branch, indicating that if anyone has a problem with any elected official, they can take it to Court. After discussion between Bill Garcia and Bill Hopkins on the actual oversight allowed the Court, Bill Hopkins stated there is no daily oversight on how an official is doing his job. Wade said if a complaint goes through the grievance procedure, then it can go to the Court for relief, and there was further discussion of oversight with judicial relief. Jackie questioned whether the problem is that there is no authority over the elected official when there is with other officials;and, in light of current events, there is at least some problem in this area. Bill Hopkins stated it is for the people to ponder, not for this committee to decide; this committee should only decide whether there is merit to the question and then let the voters decide. Bruce then reviewed the duties of the County Council, as stated in Section 3-15 regarding vacancies in office of County Commissioner; Section 13-8 which lists seven duties of the Council; Section 14-7 regarding increasing the mill levy; and Section 16-9 regarding a conflict of interest being determined by the Council. Bruce also reviewed the other attachments which are the State statutes regarding county officers, election, term, salary, vacancy in Office of County Commissioner, suspension of an officer, salaries for elected officials, compensation of deputies and assistants, and compensation for Coroner, which is separate from the Statute that deals with other salaries. Bruce said under state law,the Coroner steps in and acts as Sheriff in the absence of an Undersheriff, and is the process server when the Sheriff is a party to the matter or disqualified. For instance, our Sheriff was the property owner in an eviction process, and the Coroner had to serve the parties. Bill Garcia said Scott Anthony was in his office today and presented a hand out for the committee. Bill Hopkins asked whether there are records available on attrition for various departments,average length of employment, etc. Don said they are available; however, comparisons have not been made between departments run by Elected Officials and Department Heads. He said there is a high turnover rate in correctional officers which is just the nature of the job; however, for clerical people there does not appear to be higher turnover in any one office than another. Don said Weld County's turnover is less than 15 percent,which is less than employers in the area; and attributed that to being a governmental entity with good fringe benefits, etc. Dwaine said questions were raised as to the County Council in previous meetings, and introduced Joyce Smock,Vice President of the Council,who said she would address any questions regarding the Council. She distributed information regarding the County Council, dates and locations of meetings, and an organizational chart. Responding to Wade's question of how the Council keeps from stumbling over the rest of the govemment, Joyce stated they simply look at the Charter and do what it says. She stated the Council gets information from County employees, and that many of the meetings are simply to keep them informed about what is going on in county government. Joyce said the Council does not have much power, and responded to other questions from Wade stating the Charter established the Council as a watchdog agency over County government. Jim Gardner said it was originally established through the Home Rule Charter because someone was needed to set salaries, remove Commissioners from office, and appoint Commissioners, as well as to have local control over those things instead of following State statutes. Jackie explained at Charter Study Committee August 15, 2001, Page 4 the time the charter was adopted, there was a fair amount of distrust of County Commissioners in Weld County,and Chuck said it was created as an ombudsman for use if a problem existed in one of the County departments. Jackie stated one of the main duties of the Council was its ability to override the five percent tax limitation; and she further stated that with a performance audit of the Treasurer's Office, for instance, the Council has no real authority to take action based on that report. Jackie summarized that the first decision the committee needs to make is whether the issue of elected versus appointed officials should be recommended for placement on the ballot; and that any other recommendation will in part be determined by that. She stated the committee needs to come to a resolution on this issue. Wade said he checked with people, mainly senior citizens,who were consistent in voting and their attitude about voting, who come from an era where they feel responsible for voting. They want to have representative government,without exception;and that to make elected officials appointed is kin to imperialism of the Crown. He said they indicated it was an attitude of you are not smart enough to take care of yourself, so I will take care of you; and that they are the ones paying for government, whether good or bad, so if a bad decision is made, they pay for it. He said they do not want their votes made invalid by having a few individuals who would appoint all the other officials; therefore, he is in support of leaving all the officials elected. He is in favor of placing term limits on the ballot, for all County officers. Bill Hopkins questioned the veracity of the question when presented in the context of losing the right to vote, and asked how the voter gets to the information the Personnel Department would have, in order to make the final determination of the most highly qualified individual for the job. Jackie agreed that representative govemment is desirous for policy making officials; however,she pointed out we have established the five officials are administrative, not policy making. She said they are not governing; therefore, it is not necessary to vote for them. She also stated we are not here to gauge public sentiment,but to determine what makes sense in terms of County government and recommendations for changes. She also spoke to the issue of patronage, stating more political patronage is present for the Elected Official who can appoint his campaign manger as his Chief Deputy, if desired. Chuck stated if this issue is recommended for the ballot,they absolutely need information available and in place to answer questions about how the official would be appointed, how long the term would be, how he would be removed if not fulfilling job responsibilities, etc., and that the rules and regulations need to be in place prior to the election. He said the electors need to decide about term limits on County officials, except for County Commissioners. Bill Hopkins stated it will be a very difficult voter education process, and to think that the average voter would get close to the detail the committee has had would be naive. He said he is intrigued by what the voters would do if they had a decent understanding of the issue, allowing the County Commissioners to govern,elect only them;they,in turn,would put the proper administrative people into place in other areas. Chuck stated if officials are appointed, there is a need to have knowledgeable people on the committee which appoints. Responding to Bill Hopkins,Bruce stated if this committee includes a majority and a minority recommendation,the Commissioners may act on either position. He reiterated the Commissioners may agree, disagree, or add another issue to what this committee recommends. Bill Garcia reiterated the he feels if appointment is the recommendation, it should be on each of the five. His position is whether a need for change exists since, with a few exceptions, the governance of Weld County has been well served by Elected Officials; he does not feel change is necessary; the oversights we have are adequate; and he is comfortable with the oversights the Elected Officials have. Charter Study Committee August 15, 2001, Page 5 Jackie stated she would like to resolve the appointment/election decision first, so the other issues can be determined,such as if elected,should there be term limits applied. Chuck stated term limits do not have to be broken down to each official, and Dwaine stated he is interested in considering the appointment of the Treasurer and the Coroner who have no supervision, although there is an umbrella of supervision over the Sheriff,Assessor, and Clerk. Dwaine said the Treasurer has no checks or balances, supervision, or investigative look see, and the Coroner is "king" since the District Attorney cannot reach him, and it is questionable whether even a judge can overturn him. Bill Hopkins stated if you have oversight, it is the safety net where there is misconduct; however, he is looking beyond that, to a mechanism of government through offices that are efficient, consistent, and well supervised, not the result of a knee jerk reaction to a certain situation. He stated there is a huge difference in oversight if someone does wrong, and no oversight if he does not, and that he would want oversight well written out so it is done in certain ways. He said he wants all Elected Officials to have the same amount of oversight. Jackie summarized that it appears Bill Garcia and Wade feel if it's not broke, don't fix it; Dwaine wants to separate out the Treasurer and Coroner to be appointed;and Bill Hopkins agrees with her that logic applies to each Elected Official. Chuck stated he is more in line with Bill Garcia and Wade since he does not think the public is ready to make this kind of change; however, he is not against giving the voter the right to decide the issue. Wade said the hue and cry is not there for the voters to decide this issue. In further discussion, Jackie stated that many times the Commissioners have been powerless in cases of Elected Official inefficiencies and, since they are accountable to the people for how County government operates,they should have the authority to make sure the work gets done correctly. Bill Hopkins said this would give the people of Weld County a way to vote for a more efficient way of government and a more cost-effective government. Dwaine says he has been looking at the jobs, oversight, and umbrella of supervision, and he is concerned only with the two. Wade said people in the southwest part of the county have an adverse reaction to Greeley and may oppose this because it is a "Greeley thing". Chuck asked where government is going and whether this is a step forward, and whether it is in the future to elect five main officials and let them do everything and appoint everyone. He said the perfect dictator is a fine individual; however,there is also a Hitler. Bill Hopkins said he does not think any fundamental change would happen if this were put into effect, and pointed out that all the checks and balances in federal and state government fall apart when it gets down to Weld County's level. He said we do not have the three branches government for checks and balances at a local level, and asked where those were lost. Bill Garcia said it depends on whether voting is a responsibility or a right and said he thinks it is both. He also said if we trim down the responsibility from ten to five, are we providing a vehicle for citizens to advocate responsibility. Bill Hopkins said, however, that voting is not a legal obligation, and no one is accountable for not voting; voters have to be motivated, and this would not be sending an adverse message Jackie agreed it would be giving more authority because it would focus responsibility on the Commissioners. Jackie stated she will like a decision on this issue, or a minority or majority report. She asked for input from Bruce about the mechanics,what the wording should be on the ballot,and how it would mesh with the other issues. Bruce stated when the Charter was put into effect, it was easy to include things; however, when trying go back and get changes, it is extremely difficult. He said Section 6-1 can be changed quite easily, and indicated it would be nice if it were all one way or the other. He said if choice is to have some be elected and some appointed, there is more of a challenge as to how the ballot and exact changes should be worded. Bruce stated he would recommend changing Section 6-1 to refer to each section to see where elected or appointed officers are; and indicated that TABOR requires a single subject for each item on the ballot. He Charter Study Committee August 15, 2001, Page 6 said there really are different scenarios--all appointed, some appointed and some not, changes in terms limits, etc. Responding to Jackie concerning the wording on ballot, Bruce said he would research it; however, he thinks we would have to vote on each individual language change. Jackie said we will begin the next meeting, on August 22, 2001, with making a decision on the elected/appointed issue; then discuss input on mechanical changes; salary, term limits, etc. Responding to Bill Hopkins, the committee agreed there is no reason to pursue changes to the section regarding the County Council, since that would put too much on the ballot, and effectively kill the rest of it. The meeting was adjourned at 9:15 p.m. /Lie/ Carol A. Harding Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee August 15, 2001, Page 7 HOME RULE CHARTER STUDY COMMITTEE MINUTES August 23, 2001 7:00 PM MEMBERS PRESENT: Chuck Carlson Wade Carlson Don Cummins Bill Garcia Bill Hopkins Jackie Johnson Dwaine Kurtz MEMBERS ABSENT: Mark Gray ALSO PRESENT: Don Warden, Director, Finance and Administration Lee Morrison, Assistant County Attorney Carol Harding, Acting Clerk to the Board Chair Jackie Johnson called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m. and stated the first issue to be discussed is the issue of whether currently elected officials should be appointed; the second issue is term limits; the third issue is whether to change the County Council role with respect to setting salaries and filing vacancies; the fourth issue is whether to establish qualifications for elected officials; and the fifth issue is whether to change the provision requiring employees to take a leave without pay in order to run for partisan office. She stated the committee was close to a vote on the first issue; however, staff had been asked to provide specific ballot language. Lee Morrison, Assistant County Attorney, responded to Jackie stating every word to be changed in the Charter does not have to appear on the ballot; however, each issue must be separated, and a distinction made between a single topic and a single issue. Lee stated he feels those discussed here have been single issues; therefore; if the committee wants them all put into one question, it could be, "Should all elected officials, other than County Councilmen and County Commissioners, be appointed as Directors of Departments?" He provided the exact wording for the ballot and said if the committee wishes to vote for each of the elected officials separately, this question would need to be listed for each official. Responding to Bill Garcia, Lee said the official, if appointed, would have the same rights as every other County employee,with discipline up to and including dismissal, with the right to grieve. Chuck raised the issue of what would happen if the elected official were changed to appointive office; however, the Chief Deputy remained exempt from the County personnel system. Lee offered proposed wording to eliminate the Chief Deputy position, and he also suggested it could be brought under the County merit personnel system. Discussion was held on whether the two questions could be put on the ballot together; however, Lee cautioned it does not appear to be a single issue, but two separate questions. Responding to Jackie, Don Warden suggested the committee could recommend a change in the Section that exempts the Chief Deputies from the personnel system, and Lee responded that works if all are being done at once. Don suggested the language could stated if the official is elected, the Chief Deputy is exempt, if the official is appointed, the Chief Deputy is not exempt. After further discussion regarding the exemption of Chief Deputies from the personnel system, discussion of Section 4-2(B)(7) listing those currently exempted, hiring of deputies, and the judiciary role concerning certain officials, Jackie asked if the committee is ready for a vote on whether to accept the language as proposed by Lee, or to repeat the question for each of the five officials. Bill Hopkins stated it is a fair method and gives the voter the opportunity to differentiate; Wade Carlson stated they officials all fulfill an administrative role, therefore what applies to one applies to all, although he would agree it is compatible to voter discretion and would agree with the separation; Bill Garcia stated he does not see them all as being administrative, each has a uniqueness to it, and he would like to pull the Sheriff out, although he agrees the voter should decide, Don Cummins stated he concurs with Bill Hopkins, and by separating it into each elected official, the voter will make know his preference; Dwaine stated he never advocated a blanket position of all elected officials being appointed, and he would like only two elected officials changed. Bill Garcia moved to have the committee vote on each official to see whether the majority of the committee wants each one listed on the ballot. Wade seconded the motion;however, Bill Hopkins stated it is inappropriate. He said the committee should concede the electors can vote intelligently, not try to say they are capable of deciding this, but not deciding that. On a roll call vote, the motion carried 4 to 3, with Bill Hopkins, Jackie Johnson, and Don Cummins voting against the motion. Chuck stated he, personally, thinks all five offices should stay elected, however, he understands allowing the people to vote on each one. Don Cummins moved to recommend the Assessor be appointed, and Bill Hopkins seconded the motion. On a roll call vote,the motion carried 5 to 2,with Bill Garcia and Dwaine Kurtz voting against the motion. Don Cummins moved to recommend the Clerk and Recorder be appointed, and Wade Carlson seconded the motion. On a roll call vote, the motion carried 5 to 2, with Bill Garcia and Dwaine Kurtz voting against the motion. Bill Hopkins moved, and Don Cummins seconded, to recommend the Sheriff be appointed. On a roll call vote, the motion carried 4 to 3, with Wade Carlson, Bill Garcia, and Dwaine Kurtz voting against the motion. Don Cummins moved to recommend the Treasurer be appointed, and Bill Hopkins seconded. Wade asked for clarification about the interface between the Treasurer's Office and Finance Department. Don Warden explained that the Treasurer's duties are investment of monies, being the "bank" of Weld County, and collecting taxes; while the Accounting and Finance Departments perform the bookkeeping function and reconcile the funds. On a roll call vote, the motion carried 6 to 1, with Bill Garcia voting against the motion. Don Cummins moved to recommend the Coroner be appointed, and Dwaine Kurtz seconded the motion. Wade asked what happens in those instances where the Coroner performs the duties of the Sheriff. Lee explained there would still be a Coroner position, however, it would be appointed instead of elected; and Don Warden stated he would still act for the Sheriff at times, for example, when the Sheriff is party to an action, the Coroner would have to provide Service of Process. On a roll call vote, the motion carried 5 to 1, with Bill Garcia voting against the motion. Jackie summarized that all five have been recommended to be placed on the ballot, with the language proposed by Lee;and stated there is no issue with deputies,except for the Undersheriff. Lee stated someone would be available to fulfill the function of Undersheriff,whether that is the title or not, and indicated in Subparagraph 7 the Undersheriff is separated from the other Chief Deputies. During discussion,Jackie questioned whether the Undersheriff should be placed under the personnel system. Bill Hopkins asked whether this committee feels that would be the most favorable position,and stated the Undersheriff should be free to make decisions separate from the Sheriff. Bill Garcia argued it would not be patronage, the appointment would be of a general Charter Study Committee August 23, 2001, Page 2 deputy,and Lee indicated the training requirements are established in Section 10-4. Jackie asked for clarification from Lee that the language proposed on page 2 would exempt the position of Undersheriff or include him in the personnel system. Lee said he has two drafts, the office could be eliminated, which is on page 2, or there could be a change to the section "to serve during the pleasure of the Sheriff' to "pursuant to the County personnel system." Responding to further questions from Jackie, Lee stated the recommendation as currently written is to eliminate the position, which is consistent with how the Sheriff is currently operating. Ed Jordan, Sheriff, said he does have a Manager level position named as Undersheriff, although he is not sure which way would work best. Don Warden pointed out that another interpretation of Subsection 7 is that the Board may, in its discretion, except the Undersheriff and chief deputy of each elected official. Jackie stated, however, Section 10-3 says the Undersheriff serves at the pleasure of the Sheriff, thereby resolving any ambiguity. Jackie suggested the committee include a recommendation to eliminate the position of Undersheriff and allow the Sheriff to hire a qualified deputy to fulfill those duties. Wade so moved, and Bill Hopkins seconded the motion. On a roll call vote, the motion carried unanimously. Jackie stated the next issue is term limits and whether to recommend a change to eliminate term limits for local officials. Lee stated the proposed language would return the County to what was in the Charter prior to the State amendment, and only one set of rules would apply in the County. Bill Hopkins asked if the County Commissioners are included,and whether it could be clarified they were not included, and Lee discussed the conflict which would occur with partial terms. Responding to further questions from Bill Hopkins, Lee said he could spell out expressly what is currently in the Charter,in order that the voter would know expressly what the ballot measure would accomplish. Bill Hopkins stated he is satisfied that Lee can work with the language to clarify the wording. Wade stated he thinks all term limits should be abolished; however Dwaine said he hates to put it all under the same umbrella and Jackie stated she sees reasons to leave term limits in effect for the County Commissioners. Bill Garcia said term limits have served the County well and individuals running for office are fulfilling a service to the County while taking time away from their careers, etc. Jackie clarified we need to adopt language and consider the five elected officials might not change to appointive. She said the three choices are to remove term limits as Lee has suggested the language, eliminate all term limits, or make no change. Chuck moved to eliminate term limits except for the County Commissioners and County Council. Don Cummins seconded the motion. Lee clarified the currently language is for the five officials, and it could then be amended to add other officials if desired. During the roll call vote, Bill Hopkins questioned what, exactly, a vote means and stated this is like a lightning rod, that just before a general election where four republicans are term limited, this committee would recommend elimination of term limits. He stated it would be more appropriately placed on the ballot in the next few years, instead of this year. Jackie clarified this vote is for the five officials only, not including County Commissioner and County Council. On a roll call vote,the motion was defeated 5 to 2,with Chuck and Dwaine voting in favor. Wade moved the committee recommend the limitation on terms be abolished. The motion died because there was no second. Jackie asked if there is any discussion regarding the duties of the County Council in setting salaries and filing vacancies. Bill Hopkins moved there be no recommendation for change. The motion was seconded by Wade. Bill Garcia reminded the committee of a previous discussion regarding the use of the party vacancy committees in cases of a vacancy. Wade stated he feels the County Council would do that in any case; however, Dwaine pointed out the Council is not mandated to do so. On a call for the vote, the motion carried 5 to 1 with Bill Garcia voting against the motion and Dwaine abstaining. Charter Study Committee August 23, 2001, Page 3 On the issue of changing the Charter to include qualifications and standards of performance for Elected Officials, Don Cummins moved the committee recommend no change. With Chuck seconding the motion, and on a roll call vote the motion carried with 6 votes for and Dwaine abstaining. Regarding employees having to go on leave-without-pay status in order to run for a partisan office, Wade Carlson moved and Bill Hopkins seconded the motion to recommend elimination of this requirement from the Charter. On a roll call vote, the motion carried unanimously. Jackie asked for input regarding how the report and recommendations should be framed and suggested Lee draft it, including the specific language that would be changed. She would then have him circulate it to all committee members to refine and return without having another meeting. She also stated if someone wanted to submit a minority report directly to the Board of County Commissioners,they could,with a copy to each member of the committee. Bill Hopkins questioned whether there should be a majority report to cover the rationale behind the recommendations,and Lee said he had planned only to do the formal language, however if directed, staff can include rationale. Wade stated he feels there should not be any minority reports, and Bill Hopkins stated several points have risen to the top and there are a few compelling reasons for the recommendations, therefore, the Board needs to have input on the debates conducted by this committee. Lee questioned whether the issue and discussion documents are sufficient,and Jackie stated Lee is referring to the memo which was used for the public hearings. She stated the report can include the issues, as well as the pros and cons; however, she would ask that only the favorable recommendations be included. Wade suggested Jackie collaborate with staff, or speak in person before the Board. Lee stated the item is scheduled for the September 5, 2001, Board of County Commissioners regular meeting, and staff will send the report to committee members as soon as possible, with comments being sent back by committee members by August 29, 2001. Wade, Bill Hopkins, and Bill Garcia said Jackie can approve the report and collaborate with staff. Dwaine said although the committee reached consensus, no priorities were attached, some were housekeeping and some were changes of philosophy, and if he were to do a minority report it would be on the fact that priorities should be established and housekeeping items left until next year. After further discussion, no limitations were placed on the committee members who may write minority reports or attend the Board meeting and speak for themselves, although Jackie will attend and speak for the majority of the committee. After the committee expressed their thanks to Jackie for acting as chair and to staff members who have assisted the committee, Jackie adjourned the meeting at 9:00 p.m. Carol A. Harding �--� Acting Clerk to the Board Charter Study Committee August 23, 2001, Page 4 Hello