HomeMy WebLinkAbout20082647.tiff PUBLIC MEETING MINUTES
RE: PUBLIC INPUT MEETING CONCERNING THE PAWNEE NATIONAL GRASSLANDS,
SPECIFICALLY, BURNING, PRAIRIE DOGS, MANAGEMENT PLAN, AND POTENTIAL
CONSOLIDATION OF PARCELS
A public input meeting was conducted on September 9, 2008, at 6:00 p.m., with the following
present:
Commissioner David E. Long
Commissioner Robed D. Masden
Commissioner William F. Garcia
Also present:
Deputy Clerk to the Board, Esther Gesick
County Attorney, Bruce Barker
I hereby certify that pursuant to a Press Release, dated September 2, 2008, a public meeting was
conducted to consider public input about burning on the grasslands, prairie dogs, the Pawnee
National Grasslands Management Plan, and potential consolidation of grassland parcels.
Commissioner Long made this a matter of record and stated despite some confusion regarding
starting time, Brian Allmer, The Barn Radio Network, is web casting the meeting live at
www.barnmedia.net, and he introduced the County representatives present. Commissioner Long
stated there are various situations that have been going on for some time, and the County is trying
to initiate some discussion and action regarding the Pawnee National Grasslands region and the
working relationship among the U.S. Forest Service, property owners, and Weld County. He
encouraged speakers to present their ideas for the future,versus rehearsing issues of concern that
have been raised in the past.
Bruce Barker, County Attorney, stated Mick Mizner proposed the idea of Coordination to County
representatives and suggested a review of Federal statutes regarding Coordination between the
Federal and local governments. Mr. Barker stated there are also some State statutes which
specifically state that federal agencies must coordinate with local agencies in the creation of plans.
He stated the Environmental Assessment for the area has raised two primary issues of concern:
1) the handling of prairie dogs, and 2) prescribed burns. He stated it seems the local County
government should be coordinating with the Federal government to address the concerns of, and
impacts on, the land owners in the area. Mr. Barker stated he reviewed the State statutes and
found some that deal with prairie dog eradication and the determination that the Board of County
Commissioners may designate an area for eradication of the species as a pest. He stated the
statutes also deal with prescribed burns and indicate a plan may be created by the Board of County
Commissioners, in conjunction with the State and any other local governments. He stated there
is a plan in place on sharing emergency resources when there is a wildfire; however, the statutes
also specifically state the Board of County Commissioners may create a Fire Management Plan.
Mr. Barker reiterated the State statutes include provisions that require the Federal government to
participate in the creation of the management plans. He stated there may be other issues that can
be addressed through Coordination; however, the purpose of this meeting is to address the two
issues of prairie dogs and prescribed burning. He stated the area in the circle on the map is
considered a neighborhood and there must be coordination or cooperation in this rural area,similar
to residents within a municipal neighborhood.
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Chair Long stated the Board desires public input which will be used to start the formal process of
creating a Management Plan which could be presented to the U.S. Forest Service through the
Coordination process.
In response to Kent Lynch, area resident, Mr. Barker read subparagraph 219.9, Title 36, of the
Federal Code, for the record. He explained the State requirement allows the County
Commissioners to set laws within the County boundary, and what is more important, both the State
and Federal statutes include language that indicates they must coordinate with the plans of the
local agencies. Commissioner Long stated it is the Board's intent to start with a Plan for the two
subject issues, and the process could also be used for other issues in the future. He stated the
Board desires to take as much input as possible before proceeding with the process.
Gary Sheffler, north New Raymer resident, stated he does not have grazing permits. He stated
the area is designated as the Pawnee National Grasslands, not a wildlife refuge or recreation
center, and it is important to remember why it was formed. He stated the grassland ecosystem is
very fragile, and tampering with natural cycles impacts many species, including burning and
allowing too many prairie dogs. He stated the U.S. Forest Service is charged with protecting the
system, regardless of the views of the area ranchers. He stated the prairie dog issue needs to be
addressed; however, it must be done to ensure a proper balance. He further stated, in the absence
of the buffalo, the grassland system needs to be grazed. Mr. Sheffler stated burning drastically
impacts the ecosystem,and once certain species are destroyed,they will not come back. He urged
the Board of Commissioners to make plans for the future that will benefit both the current and
future residents. For example, he stated the pine beetle is damaging the current forest; however,
it will benefit the forest in the future because the undergrowth will be able to revive and start
supporting the wildlife.
Commissioner Long stated, by a show of hands, approximately 95 percent of those in attendance
want to generate a plan which will restrict the number of prairie dogs. He requested input as to why
the limits should be imposed, as well as general observations of the results from what has been
happening in the area.
Janice Harms, area resident, stated in Nebraska the Plovers nests are flagged, and farmers are
paid $100.00 per nest, which ensures their protection.
Ed Meyer urged the area residents to speak up and take the opportunity to express their
professional opinion regarding the needs of the Pawnee National Grasslands system.
Leonard Harms, area resident, stated the U.S. Forest Service has protected the prairie dogs on
federal lands, and they continue to spread onto private property. He stated if the source of the
species is protected, then area residents cannot protect their lands. He further stated the Service
has also been irresponsible with initiating prescribed burns,when there is a 50-mile-per-hour wind
that blows the fire out of control. He stated he was informed that they needed the wind to start the
fire, but in reality, the fires have been difficult to start as a result of the drought and very little grass.
Tom Baur, Crow Valley Grazing Association, stated he is the recipient of a lot of prairie dogs;
however, he is optimistic that there is a chance for a fresh start with the new forest ranger. He
stated although it will be difficult to correct some of the previous decisions that have been made,
he has requested a buffer between federal lands and private property, to keep the prairie dogs
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under control. He stated the Forest Service promoted the controlled burns as a means of
increasing Plover habitat; however, he has not received any data indicating whether it is a benefit,
or if it just destroys the cover. Mr. Baur stated despite the arguments being made, the Forest
Service continues to support the burning. He stated the Forest Service also relies on a prairie dog
report which was generated by an economist in Washington, D.C., which indicates the presence
of prairie dogs poses no impact on lower income class residents of the area. He stated there
needs to be a recognition on the part of the Forest Service that its actions have an important
economic impact on the area residents. He further stated there is an opportunity for a fresh start
with the new forest ranger, and he hopes the situation improves.
Chair Long stated the interest of the Board is to renegotiate the plan that was put in place two
years ago regarding prairie dogs. He stated there is limited funding for the control of prairie dogs,
although the triggers and limits have been exceeded, and that has been a source of frustration.
Gary Dollerschell, Pawnee Grazing Association, stated the Association has appealed several
processes with the Forest Service, and they fought for prairie dog control; however, each appeal
was rejected. He stated the prairie dog and burning issues have caused a wedge between the two
sides, which is sad, since the management was cooperative for so many years. He agreed the
grasslands need to be protected, and he would like to begin working forward from this point,
despite the past.
Commissioner Long stated the goal is to be a good steward of the land. He stated it appears that
science has become agenda oriented, rather than truth oriented, and he feels the area residents
are the experts, based on their experience in making a livelihood from the land.
Mr. Mizner stated the Board of Commissioners represents the residents and land owners, and it
is evident that some of the residents have lost hope; however, he encouraged those in attendance
that the Board intends to act as the middleman to assist in achieving Coordination in the
Grasslands. He stated Coordination is a very valuable tool, and the ideas that are proposed will
be backed with science, proof, and justification to achieve the goals of the region. He stated he
has seen this process work, and the attorney, Fred Kelly-Grant, has never lost a Coordination
argument. He stated he understands the area residents are close to giving up; however, he urged
them to take advantage of the opportunity that is being presented.
Robert Rohn, President of the Pawnee Grazing Association, stated he is not aware of any rancher
who goes out to burn his grass or bring in prairie dogs to compete with his cattle. He stated these
processes cost millions of dollars, in addition to the cost to comply with the new EPA plan to fence
cattle and drill new wells in areas that are not natural for grazing. He stated it took five years to
generate a plan, and at the end of that time there was no money to achieve the goals of the plan.
Mr. Rohn stated burning should not have continued during the drought conditions, and he added
controlling prairie dogs should be allowed, since they are present throughout the State. He stated
he does not want to create the drought conditions of the 1930's in order to achieve habitat for the
Plovers. He noted it cost $25 million to bring in the black-footed ferret, which are killing off the
prairie dogs with hunger and plague.
Larry Hoffner, area resident, stated he owns one section of decent grass, with a well in the center,
and when it burned it took five fire trucks, 26 men, and two four-wheelers to control the blaze, so
he knows there is a significant cost associated with controlled burns. He stated after the area was
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cleared, he found 1 Plover nest on 640 acres. He further stated there are prairie dogs on the same
property which were forced onto his property by area burning. Mr. Hoffner stated he has poisoned
the prairie dogs on his property, since he will be fined if caught shooting them from over the fence
out of season. He stated the fence lines are full of weeds which grew as a result of the damage
caused by prairie dogs and the drought. He stated the actions were taken by the Forest Service,
and now he is left with the problem of how to deal with the after effects.
Lloyd Lambertson, area resident, stated prairie dogs have been coming onto his land, and the
Forest Service has indicated it will not control the prairie dogs on adjacent federal lands. He stated
he has resorted to spending a lot of money to poison the creatures, but it is a never-ending battle.
He also noted the cattle do not graze on burnt areas, because the grasses that return are not
enough to support grazing.
Mr. Meyer stated he ranched in the Pawnee Grasslands in 1947. He stated the residents have a
right to be frustrated with officials that do not do anything; however, in Weld County the
Commissioners are willing to do something. He stated the Board must understand that the area
experts will back their actions with the necessary information to proceed with the formal
Coordination process. He stated the Weld County Comprehensive Plan includes the policy to allow
the residents to use Coordination, and he noted the proposed Plan cannot be enacted unless the
County agrees. He further stated there is no such thing as a controlled burn, they cost money, and
it destroys necessary vegetation.
In response to Chair Long, the audience indicated it would be agreeable to a controllable amount
of prairie dogs, with a buffer zone between federal lands and private property to allow additional
control.
Mr. Sheffler added the forest ranger must be included in making the coordination plan work, and
the local agency and residents need to support the current forest ranger, Lori Bell, so she can do
what needs to be done. He stated he works with Dr. Pat Reese, a renowned range scientist who
understands how grasses and forbes work. He stated most of the seeds serve as food for birds
and wildlife, and most grasses re-vegetate through their root system, therefore, it must have a
healthy crown going into the winter to establish a good, long-standing forage system. He stated
the public needs to be educated about the fragile ecosystem to ensure its greater success.
Mr. Sheffler stated he has not seen Golden Eagles in the area for the past two years,and he stated
they are more likely to be found in the developed areas where there are prairie dogs to eat.
In response to a member of the audience, Commissioner Long stated he intends to rely on the
expertise of area residents who know what the area used to look like and how to sustain it. In
response to Chair Long, Mr. Barker stated the Board is not here to figure out what will work best
in terms of management for a few specific issues, rather, the plan will include the entire area. He
stated he is uncertain how much science is needed to determine whether there is any benefit from
having prairie dogs, nor is he aware of any ranchers who use prescribed burns as a technique to
benefit their land. He stated the Board of Commissioners sent a letter to the Federal government
and pointed out the prescribed burns shift the risk to neighboring lands that may not be insured or
bonded. He further stated that he is not sure how much science can be found; however, if there
is some, then the County intends to use it.
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Kent Lynch stated he resides 20 miles north of Briggsdale, and the Weld County Comprehensive
Plan has been in place for many years. He stated the idea of ranchers having an equal footing with
federal agents is a difficult concept to grasp. He stated most people were taught the Federal
Government is at the top, then State, then local, then the People; however, it is surprising to hear
there are laws that require the federal level to work equally at the table and accept ideas presented
from the local level. He agreed the area residents are experts in the field of grassland
management and they know what the prairie should look like; however, their experience is often
not sufficient for special interest groups which require science. He stated the local representatives
may accept the expertise of area ranchers; however, outsiders tend to rely on science.
Commissioner Long stated the Coordination process places more emphasis on the people's voice,
versus strict science, and many judges would agree that the decisions of the past ten years have
been based on questionable data.
Mr. Meyer stated Coordination is a federally-mandated law that does not require going before a
judge. He stated the local representatives need to tell the Forest Service that they want to
implement a plan and they must come to the table to coordinate an equal basis. He stated if the
plan indicates prescribed burning will be banned and prairie dogs will be controlled,then the federal
and state representatives are mandated by law to make their plans consistent.
Sean Conway, Candidate for Commissioner At Large, stated it may be helpful to provide the public
with some tangible examples of how Coordination has worked in other places.
Mr. Meyer stated Freemont County, Wyoming, was dealing with diseased trees in campgrounds
in an area that relies on tourism. He stated the Forest Service closed the campgrounds; however,
the local representatives presented a Coordination Plan to remove the trees and allow continued
use of the campground to sustain tourism, and they were required to be consistent. He also
referred to a situation in Texas where School Boards and local citizens put a plan together to
prevent a major project from coming in and wiping out several million acres, and the Texas
Department of Transportation had to make its plan consistent or be in violation of federal law. He
stated any federal or state action requires notification to Weld County first, and a natural resource
committee needs to be appointed to put forth local ideas. He noted the economic stability of the
area must be kept in mind, and all parties Coordinate on an equal level.
Commissioner Bill Garcia stated he teaches American Government at Aims Community College.
He agreed that most citizens attended a basis Civics class which taught about the various levels
of government; however, over time the American Government has evolved into a form of
Cooperative Federalism, versus a layered approach. He stated the change has been gradual and
resulted in a new form of government that allows the various levels some give and take in both
directions.
Mr. Baur, Crow Valley Grazing Association, stated other issues that should be considered for
Coordination in the future might be the decrease in emphasis of grazing on federal grounds to the
detriment of grazing, wildlife habitat, the need for more law enforcement, and the problem with
unauthorized shooting on the Grasslands.
Commissioner Long stated the aim is to Coordinate an effort that is satisfactory to the area
residents.
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Mr. Mizner stated the People are the government, and the officials work for the People, and he
urged those in attendance to take that concept and work to put a plan in place.
Mr. Meyer stated Coordination is a powerful tool. He stated the Constitution is the supreme law
of the land and it starts with the phrase, "We the People..." He stated he has a long-standing
interest in Weld County, and he feels it is important to implement a Management Plan through the
proper Coordination process. He stated the Board of Commissioners has been generous to work
and try to pursue this goal.
Commissioner Rob Masden stated he is a fourth generation Colorado rancher, and he thanked the
public for coming to discuss this serious issue, in an effort to try and Coordinate with all interested
parties. He stated he works for all Weld County residents,despite District lines,and although some
may feel their input will not matter, he believes in the benefit of the Coordination process. He
stated the local representatives have the authority to require an Environmental Assessment
regarding prescribed burns and prairie dogs. He stated if the Study indicates no benefit from the
activity,then the residents should document their professional experience as adequate science on
the matter. He stated the Board of Commissioners has not imposed burn bans in the past because
they believe the residents understand the needs of the area and are conscience of when they
should or shouldn't burn. He further stated the Board strives to work for the citizens and wants to
improve the situation in the Grasslands for everybody.
Chair Long stated he will take the public input and add it to prior documentation regarding burning
and prairie dogs. He stated all of the data will then be consolidated to create a draft plan which will
be brought back to the area residents to see if it meets their goals prior to adoption.
Mr. Barker stated there are a variety of different ways to approach the plan, and it may even be
addressed in the Comprehensive Plan. He stated the local representatives will develop a plan that
works for the local area, which will then be presented to the Federal government as the plan for the
area.
In response to Mr. Lynch, Mr. Barker stated a Coordinated Plan may be taken to court by an
outside group; however, the question is whether the opponents will win. He stated it is important
to note the Statute states, "The responsible official must also meet with, and provide early
opportunities for other government agencies to be involved,collaborate,and participate in planning
for the National Forest System lands." He stated the local government may approach the Federal
government to collaborate and coordinate in the plan that is being created. He further stated
outside groups may sue in an attempt to overturn the plan; however, he feels the law is adequate
to ensure the County, State, and Federal Coordinated Plan will win. He stated it is important to
have a plan in place that all can agree with, and then coordinate it with the Forest Services. He
clarified local governments may propose a plan on an existing plan being proposed by the Federal
government and indicate their desire to Coordinate. He stated it is important to develop a
relationship with the Federal government, which worked well in the past. He stated he reviewed
other plans, where initially there was a strained relationship, but over time a close relationship
resulted. Mr. Barker stated Coordination starts with a local plan in response to a federal or state
plan, and the local representatives can go in feeling confident that the needs of the area will be
taken into consideration to result in a consistent plan.
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Mr. Meyer stated the Bureau of Land Management understands the Coordination process, and the
local plans only work if the process is done properly.
Mr. Mizner stated this is not a one-time process, and the plan will be subject to amendment, if
necessary.
Commissioner Long stated the Board will take the public input and begin drafting a plan, and work
for Coordination to ensure a sustained economy for the Pawnee Grasslands area,as well as others
throughout the County.
Mr. Sheffler stated he is busy operating his ranch and does not have time to continue attending the
various meetings that may be required to get this process accomplished. He questioned who will
need to be on a committee to ensure the area residents receive adequate representation and that
what is approved represents the needs of the area.
Mr. Meyer suggested involving the School Board members on the local committee, and he also
urges the public to keep the process open to address any unforseen issues that may arise in the
future.
There being no further discussion, Commissioner Long thanked everyone in attendance for
coming, and the meeting was completed at 8:00 p.m.
Respectfully submitted c on the 2nd day of October, 2008.
Deputy Clerk to the Board
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From: Vicky Sprague
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 12:30 PM
To: brian.allmer@gmail.com; Fort Morgan Times (fmtimes@fmtimes.com);
avillegas@greeleytrib.com; KFKA Radio (troy@1310kfka.com); KGRE Radio
(kgre@msn.com); KSIR Radio; news@kunc.org; nwh@lpbroadband.net; Pine Bluffs Post;
Pirate Radio 104.7; U.S.Cablevision of Coastal Texas(kgarrett@co.uscable.com); KUAD
Radio(todd@k99.com)
Cc: COMMISSIONERS; labell@fs.fed.us; Bruce Barker; Esther Gesick
Subject: Press release
September 2, 2008
For immediate release
The Weld County Commissioners are holding a public meeting regarding the Pawnee National
Grasslands Tuesday, September 9, 6:00 p.m. , at the old high school gymnasium in
Briggsdale. The commissioners are seeking public input about burning on the grasslands,
prairie dogs, the grasslands management plan, and potential consolidation of grassland
parcels. The meeting is the beginning of an effort to create a coordinated plan between
Weld County and the United States Forest Service regarding forest ground and adjacent
properties.
-30-
Vicky Sprague, Office Manager
Board of Weld County Commissioners
915 10th Street, 3rd Floor
P. O. Box 758
Greeley CO 80632
Telephone: 970-336-7204
Fax: 970-352-0242
vsprague@co.weld.co.us
1
,,
Esther Gesick
Subject: Updated: DURM/WG: Public Input Pawnee Grasslands
Location: Old High Sch Gym-Briggsdale
Start: Tue 9/9/2008 6:00 PM
End: Tue 9/9/2008 9:00 PM
Show Time As: Tentative
Recurrence: (none)
Meeting Status: Not yet responded
Required Attendees: Dave Long; Rob Masden; William Garcia; Bruce Barker; Esther Gesick
Building is across the street and west of the new school. Street address is 415 Leslie.
Coordination with US Forrest Service(USFS) re: forest ground and adjacent properties. Subjects for public input include
burning on the grasslands, prairie dogs, grasslands management plan, and potential consolidation of grassland parcels.
Dave Long reserved school. No PA system needed. Clerk will record and take minutes. Lori Bell of USFS (346-5003)will
be advised of date. Vicky sent press release to Greeley Tribune and north county media.
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